Talk:BPFK Section: Quantity sumtcita

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Posted by Anonymous on Wed 30 of Mar., 2005 00:57 GMT

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:34:22 +0200 (CEST), Arnt Richard Johansen wrote: > >> mi'a ca nelci le cmalu trene semau le sorprekarce > >> We like the small train, more so than the bus. > > Gee, I see the problem. IIRC that was from actual usage. I'll try to think > up an example that uses it the right way. (If *you* could give a good > example, that would be swell.)

That same example with {ne semau} instead of {semau} would be kosher.

If you want one without {ne}, perhaps something like:

mi'a litru semau lo nu stali le zdani We travel more than we stay at home.

> Is it possible/likely that this vagueness could be intentional on the part > of those who added {mau}? (I am especially asking for oldbie input on this > one.)

CLL explicitly eschews it.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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Posted by Anonymous on Wed 30 of Mar., 2005 07:10 GMT

Arnt Richard Johansen scripsit:

> Gee, I see the problem. IIRC that was from actual usage. I'll try to think > up an example that uses it the right way. (If *you* could give a good > example, that would be swell.)

Alice likes Bob more than Charlie (likes Bob) vs. Alice likes Bob more than (Alice likes) Charlie.

> Is it possible/likely that this vagueness could be intentional on the part > of those who added {mau}? (I am especially asking for oldbie input on this > one.)

No, we realized there was a problem. It's best resolved by not attempting to use semau (and friends) to create bridi places directly, but rather to hook them using ne to the appropriate terbri:

la alis. ne semau la tcarlis. nelci la bab. la alis. nelci la bab. ne semau la tcarlis.

-- Said Agatha Christie / To E. Philips Oppenheim John Cowan "Who is this Hemingway? / Who is this Proust? jcowan@reutershealth.com Who is this Vladimir / Whatchamacallum, http://www.reutershealth.com This neopostrealist / Rabble?" she groused. http://www.ccil.org/cowan --author unknown to me; any suggestions?

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Posted by pycyn on Wed 30 of Mar., 2005 14:34 GMT posts: 2388

> Arnt Richard Johansen scripsit: > > > Gee, I see the problem. IIRC that was from > actual usage. I'll try to think > > up an example that uses it the right way. (If > *you* could give a good > > example, that would be swell.) > > Alice likes Bob more than Charlie (likes Bob) > vs. Alice likes Bob more > than (Alice likes) Charlie. > > > Is it possible/likely that this vagueness > could be intentional on the part > > of those who added {mau}? (I am especially > asking for oldbie input on this > > one.) > > No, we realized there was a problem. It's best > resolved by not attempting > to use semau (and friends) to create bridi > places directly, but rather to > hook them using ne to the appropriate terbri: > > la alis. ne semau la tcarlis. nelci la bab. > la alis. nelci la bab. ne semau la tcarlis. > Good; this is the obvious solution — properly implemented. But, as I asked before, how do we do this in afterthought mode — a fairly typical situation? Come to that, how do we toss on afterthought modifications of any sort?

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Posted by pycyn on Wed 30 of Mar., 2005 14:34 GMT posts: 2388

> Arnt Richard Johansen scripsit: > > > Gee, I see the problem. IIRC that was from > actual usage. I'll try to think > > up an example that uses it the right way. (If > *you* could give a good > > example, that would be swell.) > > Alice likes Bob more than Charlie (likes Bob) > vs. Alice likes Bob more > than (Alice likes) Charlie. > > > Is it possible/likely that this vagueness > could be intentional on the part > > of those who added {mau}? (I am especially > asking for oldbie input on this > > one.) > > No, we realized there was a problem. It's best > resolved by not attempting > to use semau (and friends) to create bridi > places directly, but rather to > hook them using ne to the appropriate terbri: > > la alis. ne semau la tcarlis. nelci la bab. > la alis. nelci la bab. ne semau la tcarlis. > Good; this is the obvious solution — properly implemented. But, as I asked before, how do we do this in afterthought mode — a fairly typical situation? Come to that, how do we toss on afterthought modifications of any sort?

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Posted by pycyn on Wed 30 of Mar., 2005 16:55 GMT posts: 2388

wrote: > > --- John Cowan > wrote: > > Arnt Richard Johansen scripsit: > > > > > Gee, I see the problem. IIRC that was from > > actual usage. I'll try to think > > > up an example that uses it the right way. > (If > > *you* could give a good > > > example, that would be swell.) > > > > Alice likes Bob more than Charlie (likes Bob) > > vs. Alice likes Bob more > > than (Alice likes) Charlie. > > > > > Is it possible/likely that this vagueness > > could be intentional on the part > > > of those who added {mau}? (I am especially > > asking for oldbie input on this > > > one.) > > > > No, we realized there was a problem. It's > best > > resolved by not attempting > > to use semau (and friends) to create bridi > > places directly, but rather to > > hook them using ne to the appropriate terbri: > > > > la alis. ne semau la tcarlis. nelci la bab. > > la alis. nelci la bab. ne semau la tcarlis. > > > Good; this is the obvious solution — properly > implemented. But, as I asked before, how do we > do this in afterthought mode — a fairly > typical > situation? Come to that, how do we toss on > afterthought modifications of any sort? > Here the "obvious" solution is to use FA and the modification wanted. This seems to work with some forms — sumti: "John went the store — the short one (John)" {la djan klama le zarci fa le tordu} — but not with most others, even {po'u le tordu} the likely intention of the acceptable form. And certainly not with something like {se mau} (or even {ne semau}). I suspect there is a work-around here, short of repeating the original sumti or its pronoun (though that latter is not too bad), but it is beyond my knoledge for fiddling.

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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Wed 25 of May, 2005 20:18 GMT posts: 14214

Non-jbovlaste word:

klanrbeli

-Robin

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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Mon 08 of Aug., 2005 22:42 GMT posts: 14214

mi zbasu lo zdani te po'i lo bliku I build a house out of blocks.

Has the "a sane person would use the x3 of zbasu" problem. I have no better suggestion at this time, however.

-Robin

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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Mon 08 of Aug., 2005 22:43 GMT posts: 14214

I apologize for all the complaining I did about my words; you had to do *ci'u*. JFCOAC1.

-Robin

1: Jesus Fucking Christ On A Crutch.

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Posted by Anonymous on Mon 08 of Aug., 2005 23:21 GMT

> Examples of se la'u Usage > > le nolraitru to ri poi tcetcetcetce clani se la'u so'i > sai mitre be li pa no no toi > The king (who's really tall, hundreds of metres).

{se la'u} should tag a number, {la'u} is for things like meters. For example:

le nolraitru cu clani se la'u li so'i te la'u lo se gradu be lo mitre be li pa no no

> Examples of ji'e Usage > None found. Constructed example follows: > > do ka'e snada ji'e po'o lo se djica be do > Your ability to succeed is limited only by what you desire. > You can succeed in whatever you want.

The limit here is to snada, not to ka'e: "It is possible that your success is limited by what you want."

To limit the ability, the selbri should be {kakne}:

do kakne lo nu snada kei ji'e po'o...

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Mon 08 of Aug., 2005 23:22 GMT posts: 14214

On Wed, Jun 08, 2005 at 01:01:20PM -0300, Jorge Llamb?as wrote: > > Examples of se la'u Usage > > > > le nolraitru to ri poi tcetcetcetce clani se la'u so'i > > sai mitre be li pa no no toi > > The king (who's really tall, hundreds of metres). > > {se la'u} should tag a number, {la'u} is for things like > meters. For example: > > le nolraitru cu clani se la'u li so'i te la'u lo se gradu > be lo mitre be li pa no no

Cool. Thanks.

> > Examples of ji'e Usage > > None found. Constructed example follows: > > > > do ka'e snada ji'e po'o lo se djica be do > > Your ability to succeed is limited only by what you desire. > > You can succeed in whatever you want. > > The limit here is to snada, not to ka'e: > "It is possible that your success is limited by what you want."

I don't see much semantic difference there, actually, except in the first English translation mentioning abilit.

> To limit the ability, the selbri should be {kakne}: > > do kakne lo nu snada kei ji'e po'o...

Done.

-Robin

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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Mon 08 of Aug., 2005 23:23 GMT posts: 14214

Errrm, except this is Arnt's section...

I'll leave it alone, and he can change it back if he wants.

-Robin

On Wed, Jun 08, 2005 at 12:14:49PM -0700, Robin Lee Powell wrote: > On Wed, Jun 08, 2005 at 01:01:20PM -0300, Jorge Llamb?as wrote: > > > Examples of se la'u Usage > > > > > > le nolraitru to ri poi tcetcetcetce clani se la'u so'i > > > sai mitre be li pa no no toi > > > The king (who's really tall, hundreds of metres). > > > > {se la'u} should tag a number, {la'u} is for things like > > meters. For example: > > > > le nolraitru cu clani se la'u li so'i te la'u lo se gradu > > be lo mitre be li pa no no > > Cool. Thanks. > > > > Examples of ji'e Usage > > > None found. Constructed example follows: > > > > > > do ka'e snada ji'e po'o lo se djica be do > > > Your ability to succeed is limited only by what you desire. > > > You can succeed in whatever you want. > > > > The limit here is to snada, not to ka'e: > > "It is possible that your success is limited by what you want." > > I don't see much semantic difference there, actually, except in the > first English translation mentioning abilit. > > > To limit the ability, the selbri should be {kakne}: > > > > do kakne lo nu snada kei ji'e po'o... > > Done. > > -Robin > > >

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