Pronunciation guide in Mandarin Chinese: Difference between revisions

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.i la [http://www.evertype.com Maikl.Everson.] misno lenu djuno lo so'amei pe loi lerfu .i vlipa lenu stidi tu'a lei lerfu .i so'e selstidi poi si'o jmina lo lerfyci'e la [http://www.unicode.org unikod] cu se stidi .ebu
a  m'''a'''sh'''a'''ng (ma3shang)


.i .ebu nelci ji'a loi runti bangu .i puzi sidju la lojban. lenu zoigy. art-lojban gy. noi sinxa la lojban se zanru la .[[jbocre: iso|iso]]x.
e  f'''e'''i (fei1)


.i cu'u la [[User:Mark Shoulson|.mark.clsn.]] la maikl.Everson cu se krasi la .arizonas. .i ca xabju le gugdrneire gi'e ba'o cilre le bangrneire .i mu'i lenu binxo lo jecycmi (to zoigy. ''citizen'' toi) .ebu klama le mapti briju gi'e co'a cpedu --- bau le bangrneire po'o --- lenu se cipra; mu'i lenu jecycmi kei; bau le bangrneire .i nandu fa lenu stufa'i lo bangrneire kakne jecta se jibri .i ku'i ni'igi le bangrneire cu ritli se zanru lenu bangu le jecta; gi zo'e bilga lenu curmi lenu .ebu se cipra bau le jecta bangu .i li'a .ebu snada
i  b'''i'''ngl'''i''' (bing1li4)
 
o  du'''o''', w'''o''' (duo1, wo3)
 
u  daol'''u''', g'''o'''ngf'''u''', g'''u'''w'''u''' (dao4lu, gong1fu1, gu3wu4)
 
y  shenm'''e''', wo lai l'''e''' (shen2me5, wo3 lai2 le5)
 
ai  l'''ai''', b'''ai'''c'''ai''' (lai2, bai2cai4)
 
au  l'''ao''', z'''ao'''g'''ao''' (lao3, zao1gao1)
 
ei  F'''ei'''zhou, M'''ei'''guo, B'''ei'''jing
 
oi  fat ch'''oy''' in Cantonese (fa3 cai4)
 
ia  '''Ya'''zhou, '''ya'''zi, '''ya'''ngren (ya1zi, yang2ren2)
 
ie  l'''ie'''feng, m'''ie'''wang (lie4feng1, mie4wang2)
 
ii  '''Yi'''ngguo", '''yi''', '''yi'''wen (yi1, yi4wen2)
 
io  peng'''yo'''u, n'''iu'''rou (peng2you3, niu2rou4 -> "n'''yo'''u !)
 
iu  '''yo'''nggong (yong4gong1)
 
ua  bag'''ua''' (ba1gua4)
 
ue  '''w'''u + y'''e''' -> '''we'''
 
ui  P'''u-yi''' (don't pron. the "y"!)
 
uo  L'''uo'''ma (Rome)
 
uu  '''wu'''bi (wu2bi3)
 
b  '''b'''u'''b'''ian, '''b'''ing'''b'''ao (bu2bian4, bing1bao2)
 
c  '''sha'''wei, '''sh'''an '''sh'''ang (sha1wei3, shan1 shang)
 
d  '''D'''atong, '''d'''ongfang, '''d'''a'''d'''ao (dong1fang1, da3dao3)
 
f  '''f'''engshui, "'''f'''ei long wu '''f'''eng" (feng1shui3)
 
g  '''g'''aoliang, zao'''g'''ao (gao1liang2, zao1gao1)
 
j  -
 
k  '''k'''eren, '''k'''ai'''k'''ou (ke4ren2, kai1kou3)
 
l  "Ao'''l'''ung" ;-), '''l'''un'''l'''iu (long2, lun2liu2)
 
m  '''m'''afan, '''m'''ing'''m'''ei (ma2fan4, ming2mei4)
 
n  '''N'''a'''nn'''ing, '''n'''engli, '''n'''ongren (neng2li4, nong2ren2)
 
p  '''p'''inyin, he'''p'''ing (he2ping1)
 
r  '''r'''en, '''r'''ang, e'''r'''tong (ren2, rang2, er2tong2)
 
s  '''s'''anjiao, '''s'''angmenr, (san1jiao3, sang3menr2)
 
t  '''T'''ang, '''t'''ebie (te4bie2)
 
v  -
 
x  '''h'''en '''h'''ao!  ;-)
 
z  -
 
----
 
*If you give me the unicode codepoints for these, [[User:Nick Nicholas|nitcion]] will ''try'' and include the Chinese characters. If any of the above are � rather than u, please indicate.
 
''Following the opinion mentioned by Nick and John (rather to give discernible contrasts than produce the character's exact Lojban value in the foreign language), which BTW I do share, I decided to also add an r-entry _or_ j-entry. Given that there is no "real" r-sound in Putonghua phonology nor a "real" j-sound (is there a "real" r-sound in English?!), we have the choice to represent Lojban R ''''or''' J by the Chinese sound given as 'r' (in Pinyin) or 'j' (in W-G) respectively ('r�' or 'jih4': "sun/day"). The sound described by these conventions is pronounced somewhat between American 'r' (in 'are' - this English word sounding pretty close to py '�r' or W-G 'erh4'!) and French ''''g'''�nie', maybe comparable to the r-j mix in the Czech composer's surname 'Dvo'''r'''�k' ('r' with 'hacek'!) - but without the trill! Maybe persuaded by the Pinyin convention, I usually hear this sound like American 'r', but - on my way across the whole country - I also would hear a native of Peking area pronounce his surname 'r�n' as 'jen2' (W-G), i.e. much closer to the 'g�nie' initial. So what? I decided to take this Chinese (Putonghua) sound to represent Lojban 'r'. --.aulun.''
 
*My Mandarin dictionary lists the pronunciation of Pinyin initial ''r'' as IPA z-with-tail, which CLL explicitly lists as an allowed pronunciation of lojban ''j''... --mi'e .[[jbocre: braiyn|braiyn]].
*Yes, we're having the choice, as mentioned above, Yet, we only can take one to represent this phonem, and i decided/proposed to take the 'r'. --[[jbocre: .aulun.|.aulun.]]
 
**You're choosing to represent lojban 'r' with lojban 'j'? Well, to each his own... --[[jbocre: braiyn|braiyn]]
**There's a sound in Putonghua (represented by 'r' in py) that - in my impression - seems to be closer to American 'r' than to Lojban {j}. But that is not the question, since the Chinese language is nontheless defective with regard to - at least - these two consonants: choose what you want to - and drop the other one repectively! --[[jbocre: .aulun.|.aulun.]]
 
[[jbocre: Pronunciation Guide Putonghua - with character code BIG5]]

Revision as of 17:09, 4 November 2013

a mashang (ma3shang)

e fei (fei1)

i bingli (bing1li4)

o duo, wo (duo1, wo3)

u daolu, gongfu, guwu (dao4lu, gong1fu1, gu3wu4)

y shenme, wo lai le (shen2me5, wo3 lai2 le5)

ai lai, baicai (lai2, bai2cai4)

au lao, zaogao (lao3, zao1gao1)

ei Feizhou, Meiguo, Beijing

oi fat choy in Cantonese (fa3 cai4)

ia Yazhou, yazi, yangren (ya1zi, yang2ren2)

ie liefeng, miewang (lie4feng1, mie4wang2)

ii Yingguo", yi, yiwen (yi1, yi4wen2)

io pengyou, niurou (peng2you3, niu2rou4 -> "nyou !)

iu yonggong (yong4gong1)

ua bagua (ba1gua4)

ue wu + ye -> we

ui Pu-yi (don't pron. the "y"!)

uo Luoma (Rome)

uu wubi (wu2bi3)

b bubian, bingbao (bu2bian4, bing1bao2)

c shawei, shan shang (sha1wei3, shan1 shang)

d Datong, dongfang, dadao (dong1fang1, da3dao3)

f fengshui, "fei long wu feng" (feng1shui3)

g gaoliang, zaogao (gao1liang2, zao1gao1)

j -

k keren, kaikou (ke4ren2, kai1kou3)

l "Aolung" ;-), lunliu (long2, lun2liu2)

m mafan, mingmei (ma2fan4, ming2mei4)

n Nanning, nengli, nongren (neng2li4, nong2ren2)

p pinyin, heping (he2ping1)

r ren, rang, ertong (ren2, rang2, er2tong2)

s sanjiao, sangmenr, (san1jiao3, sang3menr2)

t Tang, tebie (te4bie2)

v -

x hen hao!  ;-)

z -

  • If you give me the unicode codepoints for these, nitcion will try and include the Chinese characters. If any of the above are � rather than u, please indicate.

Following the opinion mentioned by Nick and John (rather to give discernible contrasts than produce the character's exact Lojban value in the foreign language), which BTW I do share, I decided to also add an r-entry _or_ j-entry. Given that there is no "real" r-sound in Putonghua phonology nor a "real" j-sound (is there a "real" r-sound in English?!), we have the choice to represent Lojban R 'or J by the Chinese sound given as 'r' (in Pinyin) or 'j' (in W-G) respectively ('r�' or 'jih4': "sun/day"). The sound described by these conventions is pronounced somewhat between American 'r' (in 'are' - this English word sounding pretty close to py '�r' or W-G 'erh4'!) and French 'g�nie', maybe comparable to the r-j mix in the Czech composer's surname 'Dvor�k' ('r' with 'hacek'!) - but without the trill! Maybe persuaded by the Pinyin convention, I usually hear this sound like American 'r', but - on my way across the whole country - I also would hear a native of Peking area pronounce his surname 'r�n' as 'jen2' (W-G), i.e. much closer to the 'g�nie' initial. So what? I decided to take this Chinese (Putonghua) sound to represent Lojban 'r'. --.aulun.

  • My Mandarin dictionary lists the pronunciation of Pinyin initial r as IPA z-with-tail, which CLL explicitly lists as an allowed pronunciation of lojban j... --mi'e .braiyn.
  • Yes, we're having the choice, as mentioned above, Yet, we only can take one to represent this phonem, and i decided/proposed to take the 'r'. --.aulun.
    • You're choosing to represent lojban 'r' with lojban 'j'? Well, to each his own... --braiyn
    • There's a sound in Putonghua (represented by 'r' in py) that - in my impression - seems to be closer to American 'r' than to Lojban {j}. But that is not the question, since the Chinese language is nontheless defective with regard to - at least - these two consonants: choose what you want to - and drop the other one repectively! --.aulun.

jbocre: Pronunciation Guide Putonghua - with character code BIG5

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