Lojban vs Loglan comparison: Difference between revisions

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For the Lojbanists interested in history: a grammatical comparison of Loglan vs. Lojban
For the Lojbanists interested in history: a grammatical comparison of Loglan vs Lojban
 
 
* terminology
* terminology
** prim(itive) = [[gismu|gismu]] (see also [[gismu != primitives|gismu != primitives]])
** prim(itive) = [[gismu|gismu]] (see also [[gismu != primitives|gismu != primitives]])
** borrowing = [[fu'ivla|fu'ivla]]
** borrowing = [[fu'ivla|fu'ivla]]
** complex, CPX = [[lujvo|lujvo]] (hence pluja valsi)
** complex, CPX = [[lujvo|lujvo]] (hence pluja valsi)
** metaphor = [[tanru|tanru]]
** metaphor = [[tanru|tanru]]
** little word, LW = [[cmavo|cmavo]] (hence cmalu valsi!)
** little word, LW = [[cmavo|cmavo]] (hence cmalu valsi!)
** affix = [[rafsi|rafsi]]
** affix = [[rafsi|rafsi]]
** [[lexeme|lexeme]] = [[selma'o|selma'o]] (in the extended sense)
** [[lexeme|lexeme]] = [[selma'o|selma'o]] (in the extended sense)
** [[GMR|GMR]] (Great Morphological Revolution) = introduction of rafsi system into the language (pre-split)
** [[GMR|GMR]] (Great Morphological Revolution) = introduction of rafsi system into the language (pre-split)
* Phonetics/Orthography
* Phonetics/Orthography
** Vowels
** Vowels
*** diphthongs are ai, ei, oi, ao (= Lojban au)
*** diphthongs are ai, ei, oi, ao (= Lojban au)
*** optional diphthongs are iV, uV
*** optional diphthongs are iV, uV
*** all other vowel pairs are pronounced with glides
*** all other vowel pairs are pronounced with glides
*** no equivalent of ', so no contrast like ai/a'i
*** no equivalent of ', so no contrast like ai/a'i
** Consonants
** Consonants
*** role of x is taken by h
*** role of x is taken by h
*** Extra letters (used only in names, borrowings):
*** Extra letters (used only in names, borrowings):
**** x, pronounced as in Lojban
**** x, pronounced as in Lojban
**** q, IPA [[T|T]] = English unvoiced "th"
**** q, IPA <nowiki>[T]</nowiki> = English unvoiced "th"
 
**** w, IPA <nowiki>[y]</nowiki> = German �, French u
**** w, IPA [[y|y]] = German �, French u
** Capitalization follows the pattern standard for the European languages: used in the beginning of a sentence and for proper names. Nonstandard stress is marked by an apostrophe preceding the stressed syllable.
** Capitalization follows the pattern standard for the European languages: used in the beginning of a sentence and for proper names. Nonstandard stress is marked by an apostrophe preceding the stressed syllable.
* Morphology
* Morphology
** basically the same at time of split
** basically the same at time of split
** Loglan has added a new rule: in any lujvo beginning CVCC, where CC is a permissible initial, change to CVCyC.  This eliminates the need for the slinku'i test (according to TLI)
** Loglan has added a new rule: in any lujvo beginning CVCC, where CC is a permissible initial, change to CVCyC.  This eliminates the need for the slinku'i test (according to TLI)
* Vocabulary
* Vocabulary
** Gismu
** Gismu
*** formed on the same principles
*** formed on the same principles
*** very different in detail due to different weights (much more English-y) and presence of h instead of x
*** very different in detail due to different weights (much more English-y) and presence of h instead of x
*** see also [[Borrowing from Loglan|Borrowing from Loglan]]
*** see also [[Borrowing from Loglan|Borrowing from Loglan]]
*** see also [[The x2 place of blanu|The x2 place of blanu]]
*** see also [[The x2 place of blanu|The x2 place of blanu]]
** Rafsi
** Rafsi
*** don't necessarily have just one of CVC, CCV, or CVV forms, but maximum is still three
*** don't necessarily have just one of CVC, CCV, or CVV forms, but maximum is still three
** Fu'ivla
** Fu'ivla
*** often use h-clusters to "solve" morphological problems (e.g. ''athomi'' = x1 is an atom)
*** often use h-clusters to "solve" morphological problems (e.g. ''athomi'' = x1 is an atom)
** Cmavo
** Cmavo
*** show various "sound law" changes, e.g. Loglan gu = Lojban ku (but much more general "universal" terminator), Loglan no = Lojban na, Loglan noi = Lojban nai, Loglan keks = Lojban geks, Loglan ceks = Lojban jeks.
*** show various "sound law" changes, e.g. Loglan gu = Lojban ku (but much more general "universal" terminator), Loglan no = Lojban na, Loglan noi = Lojban nai, Loglan keks = Lojban geks, Loglan ceks = Lojban jeks.
* Grammar
* Grammar
** masses/sets
** masses/sets
** abstraction
** abstraction
** modals
** modals
** tenses
** tenses
** relative clauses
** relative clauses
** Imperative
** Imperative
*** formed by omitting the x1 argument
*** formed by omitting the x1 argument
** [[mekso|mekso]]
** [[mekso|mekso]]
** attitudinals
** attitudinals
** negation
** negation
** termsets
** termsets
** Vocatives: hoi instead of doi (as in "[http://www.loglan.org/Texts/vizka-la-spat.html rano, hoi Spat. I prano.]")
** Vocatives: hoi instead of doi (as in "[http://www.loglan.org/Texts/vizka-la-spat.html rano, hoi Spat. I prano.]")
** ??? what else
** ??? what else
* Usage/Style
* Usage/Style
 
** [[ELG: Raising|sumti raising]]
** [[sumti raising|sumti raising]]

Revision as of 10:33, 12 May 2014

For the Lojbanists interested in history: a grammatical comparison of Loglan vs. Lojban

  • terminology
  • Phonetics/Orthography
    • Vowels
      • diphthongs are ai, ei, oi, ao (= Lojban au)
      • optional diphthongs are iV, uV
      • all other vowel pairs are pronounced with glides
      • no equivalent of ', so no contrast like ai/a'i
    • Consonants
      • role of x is taken by h
      • Extra letters (used only in names, borrowings):
        • x, pronounced as in Lojban
        • q, IPA [T] = English unvoiced "th"
        • w, IPA [y] = German �, French u
    • Capitalization follows the pattern standard for the European languages: used in the beginning of a sentence and for proper names. Nonstandard stress is marked by an apostrophe preceding the stressed syllable.
  • Morphology
    • basically the same at time of split
    • Loglan has added a new rule: in any lujvo beginning CVCC, where CC is a permissible initial, change to CVCyC. This eliminates the need for the slinku'i test (according to TLI)
  • Vocabulary
    • Gismu
    • Rafsi
      • don't necessarily have just one of CVC, CCV, or CVV forms, but maximum is still three
    • Fu'ivla
      • often use h-clusters to "solve" morphological problems (e.g. athomi = x1 is an atom)
    • Cmavo
      • show various "sound law" changes, e.g. Loglan gu = Lojban ku (but much more general "universal" terminator), Loglan no = Lojban na, Loglan noi = Lojban nai, Loglan keks = Lojban geks, Loglan ceks = Lojban jeks.
  • Grammar
    • masses/sets
    • abstraction
    • modals
    • tenses
    • relative clauses
    • Imperative
      • formed by omitting the x1 argument
    • mekso
    • attitudinals
    • negation
    • termsets
    • Vocatives: hoi instead of doi (as in "rano, hoi Spat. I prano.")
    • ??? what else
  • Usage/Style
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