Talk:BPFK Section: Numeric Tense

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Posted by pycyn on Fri 06 of Aug., 2004 21:26 GMT posts: 2388
What do {roi} and {re'u} mean? The cases of {roi} seem to have nothing to do with intervals (as per definition) but rather count occasions. No instances of {re'u} have turned up in my check (incomplete files).
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Posted by xorxes on Fri 06 of Aug., 2004 21:56 GMT posts: 1912

> What do {roi} and {re'u} mean? The cases of {roi} seem to have nothing to do > with intervals (as per definition) but rather count occasions. No instances > of {re'u} have turned up in my check (incomplete files).

I proposed:

number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number

In other words, they tag an interval when the main event is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the numberth time in the case of re'u.

mu'o mi'e xorxes


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Posted by pycyn on Sat 07 of Aug., 2004 03:06 GMT posts: 2388

Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it. This may be useful, but the connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

Jorge Llamb�as wrote:I proposed:

number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number

In other words, they tag an interval when the main event is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the numberth time in the case of re'u.

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Posted by xorxes on Sat 07 of Aug., 2004 03:06 GMT posts: 1912

pc: > Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it.

No, it was somewhere else, on irc I think.

> This may be useful, but the > connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

It's the same thing: n-roi indicates that something happens n times, n-re'u indicates that it happens for the n-th time (i.e. we are talking of the n-th repetition.)

> Jorge Llamb�as wrote:I proposed: > > number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number > number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number > > In other words, they tag an interval when the main event > is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the > numberth time in the case of re'u. >


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Posted by rab.spir on Sat 07 of Aug., 2004 06:47 GMT posts: 152

On Fri, Aug 06, 2004 at 02:26:32PM -0700, wikidiscuss@lojban.org wrote: > Re: BPFK Section: Numeric Tense > What do {roi} and {re'u} mean? The cases of {roi} seem to have nothing to do with intervals (as per definition) but rather count occasions. No instances of {re'u} have turned up in my check (incmavo complete files).

In my corpus, {za'ure'u} is the 19th most common cmavo compound. (It means "again".)

-- Rob Speer

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Posted by pycyn on Sat 07 of Aug., 2004 16:58 GMT posts: 2388

The fact that the two are related to one another does not mean they are related to the tense use. On the other hand, we do need a device for introducing intervals within which.

Jorge Llamb�as wrote: pc: > Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it.

No, it was somewhere else, on irc I think.

> This may be useful, but the > connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

It's the same thing: n-roi indicates that something happens n times, n-re'u indicates that it happens for the n-th time (i.e. we are talking of the n-th repetition.)

> Jorge Llamb�as wrote:I proposed: > > number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number > number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number > > In other words, they tag an interval when the main event > is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the > numberth time in the case of re'u. >


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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Tue 10 of Aug., 2004 23:35 GMT posts: 14214

On Sat, Aug 07, 2004 at 01:35:46AM -0400, Rob Speer wrote: > On Fri, Aug 06, 2004 at 02:26:32PM -0700, wikidiscuss@lojban.org > wrote: > > Re: BPFK Section: Numeric Tense What do {roi} and {re'u} mean? The > > cases of {roi} seem to have nothing to do with intervals (as per > > definition) but rather count occasions. No instances of {re'u} have > > turned up in my check (incmavo complete files). > > In my corpus, {za'ure'u} is the 19th most common cmavo compound. (It > means "again".)

Well, that's what we *want* it to mean.

-Robin

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Posted by Anonymous on Tue 11 of Jan., 2005 23:07 GMT

Re: BPFK Section: Numeric Tense What do {roi} and {re'u} mean? The cases of {roi} seem to have nothing to do with intervals (as per definition) but rather count occasions. No instances of {re'u} have turned up in my check (incomplete files).

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Posted by pycyn on Tue 11 of Jan., 2005 23:07 GMT posts: 2388

Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it. This may be useful, but the connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

Jorge Llambías wrote:I proposed:

number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number

In other words, they tag an interval when the main event is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the numberth time in the case of re'u.

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Posted by xorxes on Tue 11 of Jan., 2005 23:07 GMT posts: 1912

pc: > Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it.

No, it was somewhere else, on irc I think.

> This may be useful, but the > connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

It's the same thing: n-roi indicates that something happens n times, n-re'u indicates that it happens for the n-th time (i.e. we are talking of the n-th repetition.)

> Jorge Llambías wrote:I proposed: > > number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number > number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number > > In other words, they tag an interval when the main event > is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the > numberth time in the case of re'u. >


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Posted by pycyn on Tue 11 of Jan., 2005 23:08 GMT posts: 2388

The fact that the two are related to one another does not mean they are related to the tense use. On the other hand, we do need a device for introducing intervals within which.

Jorge Llambías wrote: pc: > Where? — not in the wiki page when I read it.

No, it was somewhere else, on irc I think.

> This may be useful, but the > connection with the tense use of {roi} and {re'u} is tenuous.

It's the same thing: n-roi indicates that something happens n times, n-re'u indicates that it happens for the n-th time (i.e. we are talking of the n-th repetition.)

> Jorge Llambías wrote:I proposed: > > number roi = fi'o jai ze'a rapli be li number > number re'u = fi'o jai ze'a krefu be fi li number > > In other words, they tag an interval when the main event > is repeated number times in the case of roi, or for the > numberth time in the case of re'u. >


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rlpowellPosted by rlpowell on Tue 15 of Mar., 2005 01:35 GMT posts: 14214

From an IRC discussion about the ma'oste's definition of "pi so'e roi":

14.03 14:45 xorxes: {pimu roi} would be "half the time" as in "one out of every two times", then? 14.03 14:46 Broca: Half of one time, rather? 14.03 14:47 No. 14.03 14:47 If pi so'i roi means "much of the time", then "pi mu roi" must mean "one out of every two times". 14.03 14:47 (and vice versa) 14.03 14:48 The ma'oste claims the former. 14.03 14:48 Broca: Hmm, okay. 14.03 14:48 Whereas xorxes (and Broca, apparently) was assuming the latter. 14.03 14:48 I'm not sure it's terribly important, myself. 14.03 14:48 But I'd ilke to verify that whatever the BFPK settles on, we can get to both somehow.