https://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&feed=atom&action=historyry ly ny jy - Revision history2024-03-29T14:44:11ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.38.4https://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=92574&oldid=prevGleki: Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"2014-03-23T16:16:59Z<p>Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"</p>
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<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td></tr>
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<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>- Chartering branch clubs such as the one in Detroit, and the potential one in California.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>- Chartering branch clubs such as the one in Detroit, and the potential one in California.</div></td></tr>
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</table>Glekihttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=91386&oldid=prevGleki: Gleki moved page jbocre: ry ly ny jy to ry ly ny jy without leaving a redirect: Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"2014-03-23T14:56:08Z<p>Gleki moved page <a href="/index.php?title=jbocre:_ry_ly_ny_jy&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="jbocre: ry ly ny jy (page does not exist)">jbocre: ry ly ny jy</a> to <a href="/papri/ry_ly_ny_jy" title="ry ly ny jy">ry ly ny jy</a> without leaving a redirect: Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"</p>
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</table>Glekihttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=91335&oldid=prevGleki: Text replace - "jbocre: ([L-Z])" to "$1"2014-03-23T14:55:53Z<p>Text replace - "jbocre: ([L-Z])" to "$1"</p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 14:55, 23 March 2014</td>
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<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>A social membership organization whose mission is to provide venues and contexts for interacting in Lojban.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>A social membership organization whose mission is to provide venues and contexts for interacting in Lojban.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>=== 1. What's the difference between ILES and [[<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">jbocre: </del>The Logical Language Group|The Logical Language Group]]? ===</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>=== 1. What's the difference between ILES and [[The Logical Language Group|The Logical Language Group]]? ===</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>ILES would not control what the Lojban language ''is''. That is an application of language design, math, logic, and the sciences. ILES would solely be in charge of creating the purposes toward which languages are put.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>ILES would not control what the Lojban language ''is''. That is an application of language design, math, logic, and the sciences. ILES would solely be in charge of creating the purposes toward which languages are put.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>To work effectively as a legally incorporated entity, [[<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">jbocre: </del>The Logical Language Group|The Logical Language Group]], Inc. can only fit about a couple of dozen [[LLG Members|LLG Members]] and an even smaller Board of Directors. The Bylaws restrict membership to those with certain types of expertise. It is in charge of the language definition and development.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>To work effectively as a legally incorporated entity, [[The Logical Language Group|The Logical Language Group]], Inc. can only fit about a couple of dozen [[LLG Members|LLG Members]] and an even smaller Board of Directors. The Bylaws restrict membership to those with certain types of expertise. It is in charge of the language definition and development.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><br/></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>But according to the [[Bylaws of The Logical Language Group, Inc.|Bylaws of The Logical Language Group, Inc.]], it is also tasked with social objectives that are outside the scope of a group so small to do alone. Social functions need to be delegated to a body large enough to be democratic for the community, and large enough to stay active when half its members are unavailable for months at a time.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>But according to the [[Bylaws of The Logical Language Group, Inc.|Bylaws of The Logical Language Group, Inc.]], it is also tasked with social objectives that are outside the scope of a group so small to do alone. Social functions need to be delegated to a body large enough to be democratic for the community, and large enough to stay active when half its members are unavailable for months at a time.</div></td></tr>
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</table>Glekihttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=76038&oldid=prevGleki at 17:12, 4 November 20132013-11-04T17:12:56Z<p></p>
<a href="https://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=76038&oldid=65486">Show changes</a>Glekihttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ry_ly_ny_jy&diff=65486&oldid=prevGleki at 17:09, 4 November 20132013-11-04T17:09:20Z<p></p>
<p><b>New page</b></p><div><br />
'''<- [[jbocre: Why the Book is Right and the ma'oste is Wrong|Why the Book is Right and the ma'oste is Wrong]]'''<br />
<br />
Times issue of the scope of ''vo'a'' has come up in the past:<br />
<br />
''Inspired by [[jbocre: Jay Kominek|Jay Kominek]]'s dictum that if you're going to rehash a debate, just go to the archives and live vicariously. :-) ''<br />
<br />
(In the following, I highlight defenses, proposals, or usages of short-distance vo'a, and usages ambiguous between short- and long-distance: ''le catra be vo'a'' as suicide, or ''.abu djuno ledu'u by. prami vo'a'' where vo'a=by are short-distance. 'Logophoric' use refers to vo'a refering to the preceding sentence, which is agreed to be wrong.)<br />
<br />
Old Lojban List (could only retrieve 100 of the 151 instances reported of vo'a. Jay?) So this is not complete.<br />
<br />
Discussion:<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9008/msg00016.html : John Cowan: at the time, accepting vo'a as long-distance, I think<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00015.html : Lojbab: long-distance (I think)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00077.html : X: long-distance (agreeing with Y's hunch) [[jbocre: the email as preserved seems corrupt. X could be Nick Nicholas, Mark Shoulson, or Colin Fine|the email as preserved seems corrupt. X could be Nick Nicholas, Mark Shoulson, or Colin Fine]]<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00063.html : Nick Nicholas: '''short'''-distance (!! I think I was arguing for a short distance default, back when vo'a was labile.)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00012.html : Colin Fine: '''non-comittal'''<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9407/msg00031.html : Jorge Llambias: '''short'''-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9407/msg00035.html : Lojbab: long-distance (in response to Jorge, with history of vo'a)<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9507/msg00004.html : Lojbab: long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9708/msg00063.html : Iain Alexander: long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9708/msg00070.html : Lojbab: long-distance<br />
<br />
Long:Short:Non-Commital: 7:2:1<br />
<br />
People consistently Long:Short:Non-Commital: 3:2:1<br />
<br />
Usage:<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9103/msg00023.html : Lojbab, x1 of main bridi, logophoric (i.e. = le go'i)<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9011/msg00019.html : John Cowan (heheh), be vo'a, long-distance (i.e. x1 of main bridi, not of sumti selbri)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9112/msg00013.html : Nick Nicholas, ne vo'a and lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00052.html : Mark Shoulson, be vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9201/msg00094.html : Nick Nicholas, pe/po/be vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9203/msg00034.html : Mark Shoulson, lenu vo'a, '''short'''-distance (nu clause is x1 of main bridi, so long-distance interpretation is blocked)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9203/msg00016.html : Colin Fine, du'u vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9208/msg00030.html : Iain Alexander, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9208/msg00029.html : David Twery, ka vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9303/msg00107.html : Colin Fine, lenu vo'a, '''short'''-distance (nu clause is x1 of main bridi, so long-distance interpretation is blocked)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9305/msg00017.html : Andrew Smith, lenu vo'a, long-distance (I assume, since children are ordinarily washed by others)<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9305/msg00015.html , [http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9305/msg00016.html] : Colin Fine, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9309/msg00119.html : Colin Fine, lenu vo'a: long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9502/msg00056.html : Chris Bogart, be vo'a, '''ambiguous''' (but probably '''short'''-distance)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9509/msg00135.html : And Rosta, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9509/msg00076.html : Chris Bogart. lenu..be vo'a, '''ambiguous'''<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9510/msg00148.html : And Rosta, be fai voa, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9601/msg00135.html : Don Wiggins, x1 of main bridi, logophoric (i.e. = le go'i)<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9612/msg00011.html : And Rosta, nunybroda be vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9708/msg00055.html : Iain Alexander, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9804/msg00040.html : Lojbab, leni vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
Long:Short:Other: 14:2:4 <br />
<br />
People consistently Long:Short:Non-Commital: 6:0:1 (Lojbab, Shoulson, Fine have varied.)<br />
<br />
New Lojban list:<br />
<br />
Discussion:<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9108 : Nick Nicholas, long-distance (recanting '''short'''-distance -- which is how he remembered it, or what he read in [[jbocre: The Book|The Book]] if he didn't remember it)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9111 : Adam Raizen, '''short'''-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9113 : Lojbab, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9157 : Nick Nicholas, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9182 : And Rosta, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9303 : pc, record, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9463 : pc, record, long-distance<br />
<br />
Long:Short:Non-Commital: 6:1:0<br />
<br />
People consistently Long:Short:Non-Commital: 4:1:0<br />
<br />
Usage:<br />
<br />
Helsem:<br />
<br />
[[jbocre: I am excluding the original postings of Helsem's story, in favour of the aggregate posting [http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1995]]<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/538 : Michael Helsem, levo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/869 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/877 : Michael Helsem, levo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1079 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1081 : Michael Helsem, le vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1093 : Michael Helsem, ge ... gi vo'a, '''short'''-distance? But no real nesting.<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1336 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1415 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1578 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, '''ambiguous'''<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1591 : Michael Helsem, ledu'u vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1628 : Michael Helsem, be vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1748 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance (Possibly, but the sentence is a little opaque for me.)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1760 : Michael Helsem, le vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1995 : Michael Helsem (the short story):<br />
<br />
**le vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**be vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**be vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**le vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**levo'a, long-distance;<br />
**ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lenu vo'a, '''ambiguous''' (mi xanka le karcynunpo'u calenu xruti vo'a le tcadu: I worry about my car trouble as i return to the City);<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**noi vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance (translation garbled: mi nu'o gasnu ge lenu do se xrani ginai lenu vo'a se xrani);<br />
<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**ge vo'a, '''short'''-distance? (ti'e ge le drata ba'o garkla je'a re lamji ginai vo'a facki le nu gleki) No real nesting here, though.<br />
<br />
**ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lesedu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lenu... poi vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**poi.. ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
**lenu vo'a, long-distance;<br />
<br />
**ledu'u vo'a, long-distance;<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2348 : Michael Helsem, poi vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2362 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2383 : Michael Helsem, du'u vo'a, '''short'''-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2454 : Michael Helsem, po'u na'ebo vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2457 : Michael Helsem, be vo'a, long-distance (explicitly defending interpretation)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/3143 : Michael Helsem, be vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/3150 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/4270 : Michael Helsem, be vo'a, long-distance (I'm pretty sure that's how it was meant)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/5093 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/5231 : Michael Helsem, lenu vo'a, '''short'''-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/5622 : Michael Helsem, levo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
Counting the ge...gi vo'a as 'other':<br />
<br />
Long:Short:Other: 43:2:4<br />
<br />
Non-Helsem:<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/514 : Robin Turner, lenu vo'a, '''unintentionally''' long-distance (the ''na'e'' should have been ''cu na'e'', so this should not involve nesting at all)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/893 : tsali, ledu'u... be vo'a, '''short'''-distance? (But, I personally think, logophoric instead.)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1070 : Spigot, leka... soi vo'a, '''unintentionally''' long-distance (because there should have been a ''kei'' there, so in fact there is no nesting)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1190 : Robin Turner, lenu... soi vo'a, '''short'''-distance (Gotcha! soi vo'a, of course, is treated as a fixed idiom)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/1549 : Robin Turner, lenu vo'a, long-distance (which is why he got it right in the lessons and Nick didn't)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/2308 : Cyril Slobin, noi vo'a, '''short'''-distance (is considering co'o mi'e... to be a separate sentence)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/4393 : Adam Raizen, cei to vo'a, long-distance (but grammatically anomalous context)<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/5489 : Nick Nicholas, poi vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/6463 : Bjoern Gohla, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/6953 : Jorge Llambias, le vo'a, long-distance (whether it picks up one or both referents is being questioned, but that the reference is long-distance, and this is not a "book about itself", is not in doubt.)<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/6956 : Lojbab, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/6970 : xod, tu'a le vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/7642 : Jorge Llambias, lenu vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/8310 : Jorge Llambias, po'u le vo'a..., long-distance<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9005 : Adam Raizen, poi vo'a, '''ambiguous'''<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9009 : Jorge Llambias, poi vo'a, '''ambiguous'''<br />
<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9250 : Jorge Llambias, be vo'a, long-distance<br />
*http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/9351 : Nick Nicholas, poi vo'a, long-distance<br />
<br />
Not counting unintentionals.:<br />
<br />
Long:Short:Other: 11:2:3<br />
<br />
People consistently Long:Short:Other: 4:1:0 (Turner, Raizen, Llambias have been inconsistent, although the latter two are probably long-distance.)<br />
<br />
Usage is often determined, natural language style, by conflicting interpretations. For example, when vo'a appears as an x1, you can be pretty sure it's not going to be short-distance.<br />
<br />
''Who is doing all this wonderful work? Thank you!''<br />
<br />
mi'e [[User:Nick Nicholas|nitcion]]. For now, I'm done, and I'm going home. I doubt this actually proves much, but I'll polemicise another day...</div>Gleki