lojban MOO Untranslated Messages: Difference between revisions

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The {lo'ai ... sa'ai ... le'ai} replacement construct is used to erase some recently uttered string of words and replace them with something else. It is comparable to the "s/foo/bar/" expression commonly used on IRC.
[[jbocre: The Lojban MOO|The Lojban MOO]]


By saying {lo'ai srera sa'ai drani le'ai}, you are asking the listener to erase the most recent occurrence of {srera} in your text stream, replace it with {drani}, and reparse. For example, {lo'ai cakla sa'ai ckakla le'ai} can be translated as, "I didn't mean {cakla}, but {ckakla}."
*When you go through a door -> "do go through le stuna."
*When you look at a door -> "It is closed." or "It is open."


It's possible to switch the order of the text to be replaced and the replacement by saying {sa'ai drani lo'ai srera le'ai}.
*Health messages for wounded mobs (mooix:contrib/animate?). The "look_injured_*" messages.  Looks like eleven of them: "scratched", "bruised", "beat up", "hurt", "badly hurt", "quite badly hurt", "unconscious", "near death", "dead".  Some suggestions: {to'e cikna}->unconscious. {ralci velxrani}, {ruble velxrani}, {milxe velxrani}, {velxrani}, {mutce velxrani}, {traji velxrani}, {jibni morsi}.
*When a mob dies you get the message: "<name> collapses, unconscious."


It's also possible to omit either the text to be replaced or the replacement, leaving it up to context. For example, {sa'ai ckakla le'ai} means, "I meant {ckakla}," and leaves it up to context what string of words should be replaced by {ckakla} (in this case, probably the word {cakla}). Similarly, {lo'ai cakla le'ai} means, "I didn't mean {cakla} (but something else)."
*When mob is dead and you execute {viska ti}: "le 's corpse cu zvati"
*i do pencu gi'e facki fi lo vorme pe exits le up .e le north


It is interesting to note that {lo'ai ... le'ai} can be thought of as an "error quote," which is the traditional (arguably poor) gloss for {lo'u} and {le'u}. In other words, {lo'ai} and {le'ai} are the real "error quote" cmavo.
**i do pencu gi'e facki fi lo vorme be lo gapru be'o .e lo vorme be lo berti
*Cannot list that.


Naturally, one can erase a specific string of words recently uttered by saying {lo'ai broda brode .ua .ue .ui sa'ai le'ai} — essentially replacing {broda brode .ua .ue .ui} with the empty string.
*newid used for object not a thingset<br />
*Failed to create room.


The converse case is somewhat special: {lo'ai sa'ai se setca le'ai}, rather than replacing the most recent occurrence of the empty string (which would be useless), actually tells the listener to insert the string {se setca} at the appropriate place in the recent text stream. Where the string is to be inserted is left up to context.
*You have no shortcuts.
*The moo is going down! Please come back later.


By saying just {le'ai}, omitting both the text to be replaced and the replacement, one can acknowledge the fact that one has made an error while leaving it completely up to context what the actual error was. Thus, {.i .ai mi cakla ... le'ai} means roughly, "I'm going to be chocolate. ...err, you know what I mean."
==  Fixed ==


To summarize, the different forms of {le'ai} expressions are as follows.
* File /tmp/fileKvs2md-<lang code="en">Lojban Test User<_lang><lang code="jbo">lojbo cipra pilno<_lang> description saved.
* Welcome to the Lojban MOO!  See http://www.lojban.org/The+Lojban+MOO if you need help.


Completely machine-understandable forms:
** fi'i do ti lojbo me MOO .i la'o zoi http://www.lojban.org/The+Lojban+MOO zoi vasru lo sidju bau lo glico
** Can't do; the banner is generated before the user's language is known.


* {lo'ai cakla sa'ai ckakla le'ai} replaces the most recent occurrence of {cakla} with {ckakla}
* (Guessing that you meant to type: "who" ...)
** {lo'ai cakla sa'ai kukte cakla le'ai} inserts the word {kukte} before the most recent occurence of the word {cakla}
** to ru'a do pu djica lo nu ciska lu ma li'u toi


** {lo'ai kukte sa'ai le'ai} erases the most recent occurrence of the word {kukte}.
* It's not clear what you mean by "look". -- upon typing "look" in Lojban.
** zoi zoi look zoi ki'a


Context-dependent forms:
* Compiling grammar, please wait..
** ca'o zbasu lo genytci .i .e'o ko denpa


* {lo'ai sa'ai mutce le'ai} inserts the word {mutce} at the obvious place in the recently uttered text
*This dormitory has a bleak, institutional feel. The walls are painted a nasty shade of off-green. This is a place for deadbeats who don't have a real home to sleep; type "home" to get out.
* {lo'ai cakla le'ai} replaces {cakla} with something that is obvious from context
**lo vi sipku'a cu driri'a je bilni simlu .i lo bitmu cu tolmle noryri'o .i ti se xabju lo lazni poi na se zdani lo xamgu be fi lo nu sipna .i ko ciska zo zdakla te zu'e lo nu cliva


* {sa'ai ckakla le'ai} replaces something that is obvious from context by {ckakla}
* na'e se mipri vorme fa none
* {le'ai} declares that an error was made and asks the listener to make the obvious correction.
** na'e se mipri vorme fa no da --(Any reason to prefer ''na'e se mipri'' to ''gubni''?)
 
----
 
I have been experimenting with questions of the form {lo'ai ... sa'ai ... le'ai pei} (the {lo'ai} and {sa'ai} clauses being optional, as usual). Relevant answers to a {le'ai pei} question are 1) any {le'ai} construction or 2) any {le'ai} construction modified by {nai} (or, equivalently, simply {[[jbocre: ja'ai|ja'ai]]} or {nai} alone, respectively). It should be quite clear what these expressions ought to mean; for example,
 
* {le'ai pei} asks the listener whether they really meant to say what they just said
* {lo'ai cakla le'ai pei} asks the listener whether they erred in saying {cakla}
 
* {sa'ai ckakla le'ai pei} asks the listener whether they rather meant to say {ckakla}
* {lo'ai cakla sa'ai ckakla le'ai pei} asks the listener whether they meant to say {ckakla} rather than {cakla}.
 
By answering a textual replacement question with {le'ai} (or {ja'ai}), you acknowledge that the suggested error was in fact made. If the question was simply {le'ai pei} (i.e., no particular error was suggested), then {le'ai} acknowledges that some error was made, but does not specify what the error was.
 
By answering with {le'ai nai} or {nai}, you deny that the suggested error was made (without necessarily asserting whether or not any other errors were made). If no error was specified and the question was simply {le'ai pei}, then answering with {le'ai nai} denies that any errors were made at all, asserting that what was said was entirely correct.
 
Presumably, it may be useful to answer {le'ai cu'i} when you don't have an opinion either way as to whether or not you want to make the replacement.
 
Naturally, it is possible to explicitly deny or affirm a specific error by answering with, e.g., {lo'ai cakla le'ai nai}, {sa'ai ckakla le'ai nai}, or {lo'ai calka sa'ai ckakla le'ai}.
 
This leads us to consider the expression {le'ai nai} used on its own, rather than as the answer to a question. This essentially becomes a way to metalinguistically assert that you really intended to say what you just said. You can even explicitly mark dubious language as actually intended by saying {lo'ai ... le'ai nai}. This saves the reader or listener from having to consider whether the doubtful expression was written or said in error or whether it was done on purpose, and the likeliness of either possibility.
 
Similarly, {le'ai cu'i} can be used when you are yourself doubtful of the correctness of what you are writing or saying. This is comparable to the expression "(sp?)" used by writers who are unsure of their spelling, but {le'ai cu'i} is also generally useful for grammatical uncertainties other than spelling. (Less directly, it could express semantic uncertainty, but this is probably too vague to be understandable and useful, since listeners will first attempt to interpret {le'ai cu'i} as grammatical uncertainty, and that will usually make sense some way or another.)
 
— Daniel Brockman
 
----
 
One way to express this using vanilla Lojban is {sei zo ckakla zo cakla basti}, {sei zo ckakla basti}, {sei zo cakla se basti} and {sei basti}.  I and Eimi have been using this on IRC a few times and will interpret it identically to {sa'ai ckakla lo'ai cakla le'ai}, {sa'ai ckakla le'ai}, {lo'ai cakla le'ai} and {le'ai}, respectively.
 
— Daniel Brockman

Revision as of 17:02, 4 November 2013

The Lojban MOO

  • When you go through a door -> "do go through le stuna."
  • When you look at a door -> "It is closed." or "It is open."
  • Health messages for wounded mobs (mooix:contrib/animate?). The "look_injured_*" messages. Looks like eleven of them: "scratched", "bruised", "beat up", "hurt", "badly hurt", "quite badly hurt", "unconscious", "near death", "dead". Some suggestions: {to'e cikna}->unconscious. {ralci velxrani}, {ruble velxrani}, {milxe velxrani}, {velxrani}, {mutce velxrani}, {traji velxrani}, {jibni morsi}.
  • When a mob dies you get the message: "<name> collapses, unconscious."
  • When mob is dead and you execute {viska ti}: "le 's corpse cu zvati"
  • i do pencu gi'e facki fi lo vorme pe exits le up .e le north
    • i do pencu gi'e facki fi lo vorme be lo gapru be'o .e lo vorme be lo berti
  • Cannot list that.
  • newid used for object not a thingset
  • Failed to create room.
  • You have no shortcuts.
  • The moo is going down! Please come back later.

Fixed

  • File /tmp/fileKvs2md-<lang code="en">Lojban Test User<_lang><lang code="jbo">lojbo cipra pilno<_lang> description saved.
  • Welcome to the Lojban MOO! See http://www.lojban.org/The+Lojban+MOO if you need help.
  • (Guessing that you meant to type: "who" ...)
    • to ru'a do pu djica lo nu ciska lu ma li'u toi
  • It's not clear what you mean by "look". -- upon typing "look" in Lojban.
    • zoi zoi look zoi ki'a
  • Compiling grammar, please wait..
    • ca'o zbasu lo genytci .i .e'o ko denpa
  • This dormitory has a bleak, institutional feel. The walls are painted a nasty shade of off-green. This is a place for deadbeats who don't have a real home to sleep; type "home" to get out.
    • lo vi sipku'a cu driri'a je bilni simlu .i lo bitmu cu tolmle noryri'o .i ti se xabju lo lazni poi na se zdani lo xamgu be fi lo nu sipna .i ko ciska zo zdakla te zu'e lo nu cliva
  • na'e se mipri vorme fa none
    • na'e se mipri vorme fa no da --(Any reason to prefer na'e se mipri to gubni?)
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