Difference between revisions of "jimbob mythos"

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lai .iankis. jinga .i lai .yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy .iankis. jinga
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See [http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9203/msg00101.html] for the thread that engendered the mythos (recirculated in [[jbocre: ju'i lobypli|ju'i lobypli]] 16 and 17.) 'Jimbobs' became an term used to designate the community of active Lojbanists of around 1992, including [[User:Nick Nicholas|Nick Nicholas]], [[jbocre: Ivan Derzhanski|Ivan Derzhanski]], [[User:Mark Shoulson|Mark Shoulson]], [[jbocre: Colin Fine|Colin Fine]], etc.
  
''Sorry, that's ''those called .iankis.'' and none of them are the Yankees, they are all just one Yankee individually - try ''lai .iank. jinga
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Some explications of the email:
  
I'm not sure you're right about how ''lai'' works; I have to think about it some more.  But even if you're right, you're still wrong.  After all, they aren't called "Yank" either.  By your analysis, each is called a "Yankee."  Which would be ''.ianki''.  But Lojban cmene can't end in vowels, so you have to change it to end in a consonant.  There are (at least) two ways of doing that: remove the final vowel(s), or tack on an extra consonant -- any consonant.  Which you do is a matter of personal choice.  You might argue that one way is perhaps more appropriate than the other, but you can't say that someone is wrong for chosing to cmenify ''.ianki'' as ''.iankis''.  Back to your analysis of ''lai'' for a minute, though, what about the Heat or the Jazz, which have no individual term for the players (hmm... is a member of the Heat a Calorie?)  I would think ''lai X'' would be appropriate for a mass with a name (in fact, isn't that exactly what it means?) ''--mi'e [[User:Mark Shoulson|.mark.]]''
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*'''El Zamenhofo''' refers to adherents of the traditional Esperanto ideology, so named after the language inventor, Zamenhof, with a sideswiping allusion to Harlow's reference to El Capitan.
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*'''Il Silferissimo''' is an allusion to Giorgio Silfer, an Italian Esperantist intellectual, and one of the primary advocates of the doctrine of ''Rauxmismo'' ([http://www.helsinki.fi/~jslindst/raumo-20.html Esperanto-language discussion]), asserting that Esperantists should emphasise their achievements as an autonomous language community, rather than evaluate everything they achieve relative to the 'final victory' (''finvenkismo, pracelanoj'') of the universal adoption of Esperanto.
  
* No, it isn'tA named mass uses ''la'', not ''lai'':  ''lai'' is appropriate for masses whose components share a name, as in ''lai djonz.'' = "the Joneses".
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*'''La Dangxera Lingvo''' details the political persecutions Esperantists have suffered over the years, primarily under the Nazi and Stalinist regimes.
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*'''Schleyer''' was the inventor of Volap�k, and the archetype of the dictatorial artifical language inventor.
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*'''Bruce Jilson''' is Bruce Gilson, notorious at the time on the CONLANG list as an anti-Esperantist and advocate of Ido and other, more naturalistic conlangsHe and others worked on a naturalistic loglang eventually called [http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/3141/voksigid.html Voksigid].
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*'''Carter Jimbob''' is Jim Carter, who has worked on his own Loglan-influenced artificial languages, most recently [[gua\spi|gua\spi]]; in gua\spi text he uses the name ''kartr jym'', where ''y'' = English ''i'' in bit, not Lojban ''y''.
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*'''Ivan derJimbob, Mark Joulsonbob, Colin Jinebob, Nickbob, Bob !LeJimbob''' should be self-explanatory.
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*'''John !McJohnbob''' is explained in the exchange.
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*'''Jimbrownbob''' is [[jbocre: James Cooke Brown|James Cooke Brown]]. Calling him the First Digger is an allusion to the First Speaker of Isaac Asimov's ''Second Foundation''.
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Nick Nicholas originated the comparison between Lojbanists and stereotypical American 'rednecks' (Jim-Bob being an archetypal name of such), but does not remember why. Presumably he intended it as a mild protest at the Americanicity of [[jbocre: Lojban Central|Lojban Central]], although most 'Jimbobs' were not in fact Americans.
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''I always thought "JimBob" was a reference to the main figures of the Loglan/Lojban community: Jim=[[jbocre: James Cooke Brown|James Cooke Brown]] and Bob=[[User:Bob LeChevalier|Bob LeChevalier]].  Oh well.'' (Se non e vero, e ben trovato...)
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I don't know which image is more interesting: Lojban intellectuals that advocate doctrines, persecution by totalitarian governments, or rednecks that drawl Lojban.
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''Er, Esperanto intellectuals, but I see your point. (Kinda...)''

Revision as of 16:55, 4 November 2013

See [1] for the thread that engendered the mythos (recirculated in ju'i lobypli 16 and 17.) 'Jimbobs' became an term used to designate the community of active Lojbanists of around 1992, including Nick Nicholas, Ivan Derzhanski, Mark Shoulson, Colin Fine, etc.

Some explications of the email:

  • El Zamenhofo refers to adherents of the traditional Esperanto ideology, so named after the language inventor, Zamenhof, with a sideswiping allusion to Harlow's reference to El Capitan.
  • Il Silferissimo is an allusion to Giorgio Silfer, an Italian Esperantist intellectual, and one of the primary advocates of the doctrine of Rauxmismo (Esperanto-language discussion), asserting that Esperantists should emphasise their achievements as an autonomous language community, rather than evaluate everything they achieve relative to the 'final victory' (finvenkismo, pracelanoj) of the universal adoption of Esperanto.
  • La Dangxera Lingvo details the political persecutions Esperantists have suffered over the years, primarily under the Nazi and Stalinist regimes.
  • Schleyer was the inventor of Volap�k, and the archetype of the dictatorial artifical language inventor.
  • Bruce Jilson is Bruce Gilson, notorious at the time on the CONLANG list as an anti-Esperantist and advocate of Ido and other, more naturalistic conlangs. He and others worked on a naturalistic loglang eventually called Voksigid.
  • Carter Jimbob is Jim Carter, who has worked on his own Loglan-influenced artificial languages, most recently gua\spi; in gua\spi text he uses the name kartr jym, where y = English i in bit, not Lojban y.
  • Ivan derJimbob, Mark Joulsonbob, Colin Jinebob, Nickbob, Bob !LeJimbob should be self-explanatory.
  • John !McJohnbob is explained in the exchange.
  • Jimbrownbob is James Cooke Brown. Calling him the First Digger is an allusion to the First Speaker of Isaac Asimov's Second Foundation.

Nick Nicholas originated the comparison between Lojbanists and stereotypical American 'rednecks' (Jim-Bob being an archetypal name of such), but does not remember why. Presumably he intended it as a mild protest at the Americanicity of Lojban Central, although most 'Jimbobs' were not in fact Americans.

I always thought "JimBob" was a reference to the main figures of the Loglan/Lojban community: Jim=James Cooke Brown and Bob=Bob LeChevalier. Oh well. (Se non e vero, e ben trovato...)


I don't know which image is more interesting: Lojban intellectuals that advocate doctrines, persecution by totalitarian governments, or rednecks that drawl Lojban.

Er, Esperanto intellectuals, but I see your point. (Kinda...)