jbovlaste import colours lang en: Difference between revisions

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If the original purpose of Lojban is to test the [[jbocre: Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis|Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis]], which is that a language shapes the thoughts of its speakers, and most of the gismu are relations with English-worded definitions, isn't Lojban inevitably just as restrictive as English is as far as vocabulary is concerned?
==  colour terminology ==


No. The definitions include clarifiers that, for instance, ''salci'' "celebrate" includes funerals.
For specific colour terms, the place structure is "x1 is foo coloured".  There are no exceptions.


One can attempt to define, say, Japanese words in English, but just because you learn the English definition doesn't mean you truly grasp the nuances of the Japanese word. As, I think, xod also believes, we are in the process of discovering the nuances of the words. The definitions of the words in the gismu list aren't the real meanings of the words, merely that which can be encoded in English. --[[jbocre: Jay Kominek|Jay]]
Basic colours:


----
* black (or very dark): {jvsv xekri}
* grey: {jvsv grusi}


Huh? Why? Not that many of the ''gismu'' correspond closely with any English word; they tend to have broader meanings. Dictionary "definitions", including the ''gismu'' definitions, are not mathematical definitions, but more like indications of the typical meanings. The real meanings live in that mushy stuff in people's heads.
* white (or very light): {jvsv blabi}
* red: {jvsv xunre}


This is an absolutist argument. If it held in the strong sense, then the only way to create a truly artificial [[jbocre: conlang|conlang]] would be to base it on a theory which could not be described in a natural language at all! Otherwise you could say that, after all, it was only an encoding of its natural language description, and not "artificial" at all.
* orange: {jvsv narju}
* brown: {jvsv bunre}


''mi'e [[jbocre: jezrax|jezrax]]''
* yellow: {jvsv pelxu}
* green: {jvsv crino}


--But there is indeed a sense in which this is a valid
* cyan: {jvsv cicna}
* blue: {jvsv blanu}


concern. If a person only learns ''[[jbocre: gismu|gismu]]'' by the keyword
* purple: {jvsv zirpu}
* magenta: {jvsv nukni}


and not by the ''[[jbocre: sumti|sumti]]'', they will become an un-''[[jbocre: lobykai|lobykai]]''
The six basic colours {jvsv xunre}, {jvsv pelxu}, {jvsv crino}, {jvsv cicna}, {jvsv blanu}, and {jvsv nukni} could be understood to divide up the (circular) hue range into six segments. {jvsv narju} and {jvsv zirpu} are perhaps additional segments overlapping these?  Or are they non-overlapping?  {jvsv bunre} seems to depend on saturation and brightness for its definition. Can someone comment on this?  Is there an official mapping between these words and the colour cylinder?  Someone has produced a [http://members.lycos.co.uk/lojbanlinks/skari.html ist of representative colours].
 
user of Lojban, and their ''jbosku'' will tend to resemble
 
encoded English. All of us, in truth, start that way. But after
 
you have begun to learn to distinguish ''gismu'' with similar-
 
meaning English keywords, their true meanings will more and more
 
influence your usage. This is not, however, an especially [[jbocre: Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis horfish|Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis horfish]]
 
effect--yet. That will only occur when you are ''[[jbocre: bellyfeel erceiving|bellyfeel erceiving]]'' in terms of those relationships...

Latest revision as of 14:44, 23 March 2014

colour terminology

For specific colour terms, the place structure is "x1 is foo coloured". There are no exceptions.

Basic colours:

  • black (or very dark): {jvsv xekri}
  • grey: {jvsv grusi}
  • white (or very light): {jvsv blabi}
  • red: {jvsv xunre}
  • orange: {jvsv narju}
  • brown: {jvsv bunre}
  • yellow: {jvsv pelxu}
  • green: {jvsv crino}
  • cyan: {jvsv cicna}
  • blue: {jvsv blanu}
  • purple: {jvsv zirpu}
  • magenta: {jvsv nukni}

The six basic colours {jvsv xunre}, {jvsv pelxu}, {jvsv crino}, {jvsv cicna}, {jvsv blanu}, and {jvsv nukni} could be understood to divide up the (circular) hue range into six segments. {jvsv narju} and {jvsv zirpu} are perhaps additional segments overlapping these? Or are they non-overlapping? {jvsv bunre} seems to depend on saturation and brightness for its definition. Can someone comment on this? Is there an official mapping between these words and the colour cylinder? Someone has produced a ist of representative colours.

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