https://mw.lojban.org/api.php?action=feedcontributions&user=Kmir&feedformat=atomLojban - User contributions [en]2024-03-29T04:41:53ZUser contributionsMediaWiki 1.38.4https://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=User:Kmir&diff=111590User:Kmir2015-01-28T12:51:38Z<p>Kmir: </p>
<hr />
<div>== la kmir ==<br />
<br />
ni'o ni'o coi fi'i lo tcidu .i mi'e la kmir<br />
<br />
=== tu'a mi zo'u ===<br />
.i li 2009 ku detri lo nu mi co'a lo jbotadni .ije li 2010 ku detri lo nu mi de'a jbotadni gi'e di'a tadni de'i li 2014<br />
<br />
.i mi jinvi lo du'u mi milxe certu lojbo pilno .i su'anai mi na nintadni gi'e na jbocre .i va'i mi me la'o gy. "intermediate lojbanist" .gy<br />
<br />
.i mi pampe'o la .litcen poi finti be la'o gy "[http://exocomics.com/ Exocomics]" noi kibro lisxra .i la .eksokomiks. cu milxe misno gi'e ba'o binxo lo sezjibri be la .litcen. .i mi jgira lau .iu .i ly cu nenji gunka .io<br />
<br />
.i mi me la .djavaskrypt. zei sampla<br />
<br />
=== tu'a lo lojbo pe mi zo'u ===<br />
.i mi pilno zo lau poi cnino .e zo soi pe la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi tugni lo so'e moi poi lo se cusku be la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi troci lo ka finti lo se sanga .i ku'i nandu .u'i<br />
<br />
=== lo se finti be mi zo'u ===<br />
.i da du la srilermorna zo'u: lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka melbi .i mi jinve lo du'u da milxe se snada<br />
<br />
.i da du la zbalermorna zo'u: ji'a lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka lojbo .i mi jinve<br />
<br />
.i da du la tergerna zei jarco zo'u: pu'o xe cilre be lo milxe certu lojbo tadni .i tyjy pu'o jarco lo stura be lo bridi gi'e pu'o binxo lo pilno jitro be la .camxes.<br />
<br />
.i zo lau poi cnino zo'u: .i mi joi la .selkik. pu finti lo cnino te pilno be zo lau .i mi xenru zo'o<br />
<br />
<br />
[[Image:i-roda-mabla.gif]]</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=File:i-roda-mabla.gif&diff=111589File:i-roda-mabla.gif2015-01-28T12:47:50Z<p>Kmir: .i ti mabla .i ta mabla .i la'a tu ji'a mabla</p>
<hr />
<div>.i ti mabla .i ta mabla .i la'a tu ji'a mabla</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=tergerna_zei_jarco&diff=111279tergerna zei jarco2015-01-23T09:43:00Z<p>Kmir: Fix typos, add first diagram</p>
<hr />
<div>== Introduction ==<br />
<br />
The general idea is to make a visual way of representing the bridi structure which makes it easy to grok. The structure itself is represented with this tree-ish thing which highlights the terbri and their relationship to the main selbri. The visual structuring only applies to the top-level bridi; abstractions are just one unit. Not all grammar classes need unique shapes, just enough to make the structure clear.<br />
<br />
The final goal is to make a front-end for camxes which can display any bridi this way. This is to aid in the reading of advanced text with large, complicated, or place mangled sentences, or just to explore structures of the grammar in an intuitive way.<br />
<br />
Optionally we can colour the individual terms based on their ‘type’, given some kind of type system like (but not necessarily the same as) the one described by Tsani. (I don’t know if camxes can do that or not.) Also it might be interesting to color the tag shapes as well based on the type of their expected sumti, as given by their gismu definition. <br />
<br />
This idea is still under active development. Feedback, criticism and ideas are welcomed. <br />
<br />
== Planning ==<br />
<br />
=== References ===<br />
<br />
* tsani’s Type System<br />
* zo soi pe la selpa’i<br />
<br />
=== Explanation of Shapes ===<br />
<br />
<img src="https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1W8wmu97LLVvAQQPTGWOB9-zV3gXaSF0-U2etQJeyV4M/pub?w=349&amp;amp;h=374"><br />
<br />
==== Sumti ====<br />
<br />
Anything with a line underneath is considered a sumti by the main bridi, atomic or otherwise.<br />
<br />
==== Selbri ====<br />
<br />
Solid box. Only the main, top-level selbri gets this.<br />
<br />
==== Tags ====<br />
<br />
Bubble. All sumti go somewhere, whether the tag-word exists explicitly or not. Automatically implied tag bubbles have dotted outline. Explicitly specified, or additional (BAI, etc) tag bubbles have solid outline.<br />
<br />
==== Connectors ====<br />
<br />
Pointy-box. Should have lines that touch the selbri of each conjoined bridi. In orderless layout it might be interesting to have two bridi back-to-back, but not sure how this works if there’s more than two.<br />
<br />
==== Auxiliary ====<br />
<br />
Parallel bars. Auxiliaries are usually relative clauses like with {poi}, {noi} and new-{soi}, but I'm considering using it in sort of a reverse way as well to demonstrate {zo'u}. We'll see how it works out.<br />
<br />
==== Annotations ====<br />
<br />
Bits of speech which don’t change the structure of the bridi but which are still important to it’s meaning. Covers UI, NOI and SEI, and probably TO, and possibly new-soi (note: ask selpahi about scope). Has no shape. Because these things have a well-defined scope, they will go next to their sumti in the orderless view, or next to the selbri if they have whole-bridi scope. In-order version might need over-under umbrellas to jarco their scope.<br />
<br />
==== Vestigial ====<br />
<br />
Terminators and things like {cu} are weird here. They serve to make the bridi structure unambiguous but here we are doing it visually. In the orderless presentation these can be totally deleted, but in the order-preserving version, throwing them away will make it harder to understand the visual form’s relationship to the input text. Vestigials have no box and have greyed-out text, showing where in the input the word was for reference. Note this coloring is strictly different from the type-system coloring which conflates but I think that’s ok.<br />
<br />
=== Examples needed ===<br />
<br />
* Type casting with LAhE (re-read tsani’s pages probably)<br />
* What to do with {zo’u}? It’s a weird one. Are there more like it?<br />
* What to do with {xu} and {xukau}? Are they annotations? Auxiliaries?<br />
<br />
* Do we want to support selbri-less constructions? It might be useful to dig into complicated descriptions, there's lots of ways to build single sumti out to the size of large sentences, especially with abstractors. We should be able to pop in and out of nested constructs.<br />
<br />
=== Stuff we don’t care about ===<br />
<br />
* Sumti connectives - this just makes a bigger, fatter sumti. What can be different about a sumti it it’s type, not it’s internal structure.<br />
* Tanru connectives - tanru, including connectives and inversions, just go into a bigger selbri box.<br />
* {be} isn’t relevant at the bridi level cos it just makes longer sumti.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=tergerna_zei_jarco&diff=111278tergerna zei jarco2015-01-23T07:48:22Z<p>Kmir: Created page with "== Introduction == The general idea is to make a visual way of representing the bridi structure which makes it easy to grok. The structure itself is represented with this tre..."</p>
<hr />
<div>== Introduction ==<br />
<br />
The general idea is to make a visual way of representing the bridi structure which makes it easy to grok. The structure itself is represented with this tree-ish thing which highlights the terbri and their relationship to the main selbri. The visual structuring only applies to the top-level bridi; abstractions are just one unit. Not all grammar classes need unique shapes, just enough to make the structure clear.<br />
<br />
The final goal is to make a front-end for camxes which can display any bridi this way. This is to aid in the reading of advanced text with large, complicated, or place mangled sentences, or just to explore structures of the grammar in an intuitive way.<br />
<br />
Optionally we can colour the individual terms based on their ‘type’, given some kind of type system like (but not necessarily the same as) the one described by Tsani. (I don’t know if camxes can do that or not.) Also it might be interesting to color the tag shapes as well based on the type of their expected sumti, as given by their gismu definition.<br />
This is just a draft to exercise some ideas, please add more examples, types and grammar shapes that help make the structure of the bridi immediately understandable, and please feel free to undertake discussion in this document using annotations or whatever. <br />
<br />
== Planning ==<br />
<br />
=== References ===<br />
<br />
* tsani’s Type System<br />
* zo soi pe la selpa’i<br />
<br />
=== Explanation of Shapes ===<br />
<br />
EMBED: Shapes and types<br />
<br />
==== Sumti ====<br />
<br />
Anything with a line underneath is considered a sumti by the main bridi, atomic or otherwise.<br />
<br />
==== Selbri ====<br />
<br />
Solid box. Only the main, top-level selbri gets this.<br />
<br />
==== Tags ====<br />
<br />
Bubble. All sumti go somewhere, whether the tag-word exists explicitly or not. Automatically implied tag bubbles have dotted outline. Explicitly specified, or additional (BAI, etc) tag bubbles have solid outline.<br />
<br />
==== Connectors ====<br />
<br />
Pointy-box. Should have lines that touch the selbri of each conjoined bridi. In orderless layout it might be interesting to have two bridi back-to-back, but not sure how this works if there’s more than two.<br />
<br />
==== Auxiliary ====<br />
<br />
Parallel bars. Auxiliaries are usually relative clauses like with {poi}, {noi} and new-{soi}, but I'm considering using it in sort of a reverse way as well to demonstrate {zo'u}. We'll see how it works out.<br />
<br />
==== Annotations ====<br />
<br />
Bits of speech which don’t change the structure of the bridi but which are still important to it’s meaning. Covers UI, NOI and SEI, and probably TO, and possibly new-soi (note: ask selpahi about scope). Has no shape. Because these things have a well-defined scope, they will go next to their sumti in the orderless view, or next to the selbri if they have whole-bridi scope. In-order version might need over-under umbrellas to jarco their scope.<br />
<br />
==== Vestigial ====<br />
<br />
Terminators and things like {cu} are weird here. They serve to make the bridi structure unambiguous but here we are doing it visually. In the orderless presentation these can be totally deleted, but in the order-preserving version, throwing them away will make it harder to understand the visual form’s relationship to the input text. Vestigials have no box and have greyed-out text, showing where in the input the word was for reference. Note this coloring is strictly different from the type-system coloring which conflates but I think that’s ok.<br />
<br />
=== Examples needed ===<br />
<br />
* Type casting with LAhE (re-read tsani’s pages probably)<br />
* What to do with {zo’u}? It’s a weird one. Are there more like it?<br />
* What to do with {xu} and {xukau}? Are they annotations? Auxiliaries?<br />
<br />
* Do we want to support selbri-less constructions? It might be useful to dig into complicated descriptions, there's lots of ways to build single sumti out to the size of large sentences, especially with abstractors.<br />
<br />
=== Stuff we don’t care about ===<br />
<br />
* Sumti connectives - this is makes a bigger, fatter sumti. What can be different about a sumti it it’s type, not it’s internal structure.<br />
* Tanru connectives - tanru, including connectives and inversions, just go into a bigger selbri box.<br />
* {be} isn’t relevant at the bridi level cos it just makes longer sumti.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=User:Kmir&diff=111276User:Kmir2015-01-23T04:21:09Z<p>Kmir: Add title</p>
<hr />
<div>== la kmir ==<br />
<br />
ni'o ni'o coi fi'i lo tcidu .i mi'e la kmir<br />
<br />
=== tu'a mi zo'u ===<br />
.i li 2009 ku detri lo nu mi co'a lo jbotadni .ije li 2010 ku detri lo nu mi de'a jbotadni gi'e di'a tadni de'i li 2014<br />
<br />
.i mi jinvi lo du'u mi milxe certu lojbo pilno .i su'anai mi na nintadni gi'e na jbocre .i va'i mi me la'o gy. "intermediate lojbanist" .gy<br />
<br />
.i mi pampe'o la .litcen poi finti be la'o gy "[http://exocomics.com/ Exocomics]" noi kibro lisxra .i la .eksokomiks. cu milxe misno gi'e ba'o binxo lo sezjibri be la .litcen. .i mi jgira lau .iu .i ly cu nenji gunka .io<br />
<br />
.i mi me la .djavaskrypt. zei sampla<br />
<br />
=== tu'a lo lojbo pe mi zo'u ===<br />
.i mi pilno zo lau poi cnino .e zo soi poi cnino pe la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi tugni lo so'e moi poi lo se cusku be la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi troci lo ka finti lo sanga .i ku'i nandu .u'i<br />
<br />
=== lo se finti be mi zo'u ===<br />
.i da du la srilermorna zo'u: lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka melbi .i mi jinve lo du'u da milxe se snada<br />
<br />
.i da du la zbalermorna zo'u: ji'a lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka lojbo .i mi jinve<br />
<br />
.i da du la tergerna zei jarco zo'u: pu'o xe cilre be lo milxe certu lojbo tadni .i tyjy pu'o jarco lo stura be lo bridi gi'e pu'o binxo lo pilno jitro be la .camxes.<br />
<br />
.i zo lau poi cnino zo'u: .i mi joi la .selkik. pu finti lo cnino te pilno be zo lau .i mi xenru zo'o</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=User:Kmir&diff=111275User:Kmir2015-01-23T04:20:31Z<p>Kmir: Flesh out description for my userpage</p>
<hr />
<div>ni'o ni'o coi fi'i lo tcidu .i mi'e la kmir<br />
<br />
=== tu'a mi zo'u ===<br />
.i li 2009 ku detri lo nu mi co'a lo jbotadni .ije li 2010 ku detri lo nu mi de'a jbotadni gi'e di'a tadni de'i li 2014<br />
<br />
.i mi jinvi lo du'u mi milxe certu lojbo pilno .i su'anai mi na nintadni gi'e na jbocre .i va'i mi me la'o gy. "intermediate lojbanist" .gy<br />
<br />
.i mi pampe'o la .litcen poi finti be la'o gy "[http://exocomics.com/ Exocomics]" noi kibro lisxra .i la .eksokomiks. cu milxe misno gi'e ba'o binxo lo sezjibri be la .litcen. .i mi jgira lau .iu .i ly cu nenji gunka .io<br />
<br />
.i mi me la .djavaskrypt. zei sampla<br />
<br />
=== tu'a lo lojbo pe mi zo'u ===<br />
.i mi pilno zo lau poi cnino .e zo soi poi cnino pe la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi tugni lo so'e moi poi lo se cusku be la selpa'i<br />
<br />
.i mi troci lo ka finti lo sanga .i ku'i nandu .u'i<br />
<br />
=== lo se finti be mi zo'u ===<br />
.i da du la srilermorna zo'u: lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka melbi .i mi jinve lo du'u da milxe se snada<br />
<br />
.i da du la zbalermorna zo'u: ji'a lo ciska tadji se platu fi lo nu da zmadu lo ka lojbo .i mi jinve<br />
<br />
.i da du la tergerna zei jarco zo'u: pu'o xe cilre be lo milxe certu lojbo tadni .i tyjy pu'o jarco lo stura be lo bridi gi'e pu'o binxo lo pilno jitro be la .camxes.<br />
<br />
.i zo lau poi cnino zo'u: .i mi joi la .selkik. pu finti lo cnino te pilno be zo lau .i mi xenru zo'o</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=BPFK_Section:_Text_Structure_cmavo&diff=111139BPFK Section: Text Structure cmavo2015-01-19T14:11:01Z<p>Kmir: /* Usage Examples */</p>
<hr />
<div>== Prior usage and discussion ==<br />
<br />
=== ni'o ===<br />
<br />
Seems to be used mostly parallel to paragraph breaks in natural languages. See<br />
[http://www.lojban.org/],<br />
[http://www.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9312/msg00394.html], and<br />
[http://www.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9107/msg00052.html].<br />
<br />
On IRC, which is indicative of spoken language, this appears to have more of a<br />
meaning of changing the subject. Examples:<br />
[http://www.digitalkingdom.org/lojban/irclog/lojban/2004_06_02-02_21.txt],<br />
[http://www.digitalkingdom.org/lojban/irclog/lojban/2002_05_12--2002_11_28.txt].<br />
<br />
ni'o implicitly cancels some assignments, depending on the number of<br />
consecutive ni'o and whether the text is spoken or written. The following table<br />
is due to CLL pp. 446--447.<br />
<br />
{|<br />
! Number of consecutive ni'o !! Written !! Spoken<br />
|-<br />
| ni'o || no effect || cancel KOhA and GOhA<br />
|-<br />
| ni'oni'o || cancel KOhA and GOhA || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses<br />
|-<br />
| ni'oni'oni'o || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses<br />
|}<br />
<br />
==== Examples of ''ni'o'' Usage ====<br />
<br />
<nowiki><br />
A: ni'o mi ca'o kelci lo samselkei<br />
B: .i .ua go'i lo samselkei no'u ma<br />
A: .i go'i la'o gy. Final Fantasy .gy.<br />
B: .i .io mi nelci<br />
A: ni'o mi djica lo nu citka<br />
B: no'i mi djica lo nu jbera fi do<br />
A: .i je'e</nowiki><br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
I did not include a natural example because the usage is wide, varied, and<br />
mostly incorrect between spoken, e-mailed, IRC'd, and written Lojban. It should be used for starting new topics of discussion, which as a by-product also clears KOhA and GOhA as well as sticky tenses (IIRC). It is not a paragraph marker (whitespace can be used for that and nobody said how much whitespace is allowed), it is a topic marker.<br />
<br />
==== Issues ====<br />
<br />
* [https://groups.google.com/group/lojban/tree/browse_frm/month/2008-12/dc259d0ccb79a9d0?hl=en&rnum=51&_done=%2Fgroup%2Flojban%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fmonth%2F2008-12%3Fhl%3Den%26scoring%3Dd%26&scoring=d#doc_935fcdee29329746 Parser related comment. Not sure if currently relevant.]<br />
<br />
== Proposed dictionary entries ==<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: fa'o (FAhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
Unless quoted by "zo" or "lo'u" -- "le'u", turned into a quote delimiter by zoi, or acting as part of a lujvo made by a preceding "zei", marks the end of input to be parsed. Any remaining text is to be disregarded.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {fe'o}<br />
* {fanmo}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* The End.<br />
* parsing ends here<br />
* end parsing here<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
There is no usage other than quotes or jokes in English. The only usage that<br />
could be deemed correct is a single fa'o at the end of the Berenstein Bears<br />
books or other books.<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Described as unconditional end of parsing. Evidently intended only for machine<br />
input. Sometimes used in the sense of "the end". Some erroneous uses, such as<br />
inside of tu'e -- tu'u groups. See<br />
[http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:MpjTKbPZY88J:www.lojban.org/twiki/pub/Files/Documents/carvi.html+%22fa%27o%22+site:.lojban.org&hl=no|1]<br />
I see no reason to legalise this practice, since ''fe'o'' is available for this<br />
purpose.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: i (I) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Starts a new sentence.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {ni'o}<br />
* {no'i}<br />
* {tu'e}<br />
* {fa'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* and then<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
(see ''ni'o'')<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Ubiquitous. This is used mostly in front of sentences that are not the first<br />
sentence in the text. Sometimes also the first sentence in the text is prefixed<br />
with .i. (However, this is incorrect.)%%% It is used to indicate the beginning<br />
of a new jufra continuing on the topic established with ni'o.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: mai (MAI) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Enumerates a point in the text. Combines with the preceding numeral to make a<br />
free modifier, which can be placed almost anywhere in a text.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {mo'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* -stly<br />
* -ndly<br />
* -thly<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
MAI is postfix, this was probably decided to make it analogous to mei, moi,<br />
roi, and re'u. However, this serves to make the grammar of Lojban non-LALR(1),<br />
because the parser may have to look through an arbitrarily large numeral string<br />
to decide that it actually belongs in a free modifier. This should not be a<br />
problem if Robin's PEG parser is made official. If Robin's PEG parser is<br />
''not'' made official, however, extensive pre-processing will be required.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: mo'o (MAI) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Enumerates a higher-level section or chapter in the text. Combines with the<br />
preceding numeral to make a free modifier, which can be placed almost anywhere<br />
in a text.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {mai}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* -st section<br />
* -nd section<br />
* -rd section<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
MAI is postfix, this was probably decided to make it analogous to mei, moi,<br />
roi, and re'u. However, this serves to make the grammar of Lojban non-LALR(1),<br />
because the parser may have to look through an arbitrarily large numeral string<br />
to decide that it actually belongs in a free modifier. This should not be a<br />
problem if Robin's PEG parser is made official. If Robin's PEG parser is<br />
''not'' made official, however, extensive pre-processing will be required.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: ni'o (NIhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the start of a paragraph and a change of subject. Multiple "ni'o" in a row means higher-level section breaks. In written contexts, two or more consecutive "ni'o" cancels the assignment of pro-sumti and pro-bridi in the selma'o KOhA and GOhA, respectively, and three or more consecutive "ni'o" additionally cancels all current tenses. In spoken contexts, a single or several consecutive "ni'o" cancels the assignment of pro-sumti and pro-bridi in the selma'o KOhA and GOhA, respectively, while two or more consecutive "ni'o" additionally cancels all current tenses.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {no'i}<br />
* {i}<br />
* {ta'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* continuing to the next topic<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
Artificial:<br />
<nowiki><br />
A: ni'o mi ca'o kelci lo samselkei<br />
B: .i .ua go'i lo samselkei no'u ma<br />
A: .i go'i la'o gy. Final Fantasy .gy.<br />
B: .i .io mi nelci<br />
A: ni'o mi djica lo nu citka<br />
B: no'i mi djica lo nu jbera fi do<br />
A: .i je'e</nowiki><br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: no'i (NIhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the start of a paragraph and change back to a previous subject. If no'i has a positive or zero subscript, it indicates the continuation of an earlier topic that was introduced with the word ni'o with the same subscript. If no'i has a negative subscript, it is a resumption of the topic of the paragraph found by counting backwards, starting with the paragraph before the one introduced with ni'o.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {ni'o}<br />
* {i}<br />
* {ta'o nai}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* returning to the previous topic<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
;no'i la xrist. ba cpacu loi vanju mu'i lenu pinxe kei gi'e te preti fo ko'a felenu ko'a djica lenu la xrist. dunda dakau ko'a: ''"Christ then took wine to drink, and asked the man what he wanted Christ to give him."''<br />
From the translation of "Cardplayer", by Nick Nicholas. [http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/cardplayer|2]<br />
<br />
;no'i mi pu co'a mutce kurji lo nu jmina la jbovlaste: ''"Anyway, I take great care about additions to Jbovlaste."'' [http://www.livejournal.com/users/camgusmis/2435.html|3]<br />
<br />
Also see example at {ni'o}.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: tu'e (TUhE) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Starts a text scope, which is a group of sentences. The text scope acts as a single sentence externally, for purposes such as logical operators.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {tu'u}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
Usage is contended. No consistent natural examples exist. Arbitrary examples follow:<br />
<br />
* ro da pa de zo'u tu'e da gerku .ije de mlatu tu'u .inaja da jersi de<br />
<br />
* .i la robin. kakne lo nu djuno tu'e lo se pensi be da<br />
* mi nelci lo nu pilno zo ka'u va'o tu'e le jboklu<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
''tu'e'' - ''tu'u'' seems to be used mainly to be used to set off a large block of text and refer to it metalinguisticially. For instance, there is a (very large) mailing list thread called [http://www.lojban.org/lists/lojban-list/msg03769.html|loi preti be fi lo nincli zo'u tu'e]. Also lots of poetry are prefixed with titles that uses ''di'e'' to refer to the body of the poem, set of with ''tu'e''.<br />
* [http://lojban.org/lists/lojban-list/msg08842.html|Confusion as to the fact that tu'e clauses don't fit into relative clauses]<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: tu'u (TUhU) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Ends a text scope. Elidable terminator for tu'e.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {tu'e}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* end of text scope<br />
* terminator<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
See {tu'e}.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: zo'u (ZOhU) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the end of a prenex. A prenex can occur at the beginning of the sentence,<br />
and consists of one or more terms. A term is either a sumti or a sumti preceded<br />
by a tense or modal tag. The primary use of a prenex is for quantifying logical<br />
variables prior to their use in the sentence and/or sentences that are joined<br />
to it by a logical connective. Terms that do not quantify logical variables are<br />
instead interpreted as 'topics' of the containing sentence, and any sentences<br />
that are joined to it by a logical connective. <br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* so that<br />
* such that<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
;i lo do solri nu canci zo'u do ba lifri i mi ba mi'ecpe: ''Your sun-like vanishing exists such that you will experience it. I will demand it.''<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Marks the end of a prenex. A prenex can have one or more terms, which may<br />
constrain the instantiation of logical variables in the main sentence. Prenexes<br />
are also used as a topic field.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
<br />
== Interaction with other sections ==<br />
<br />
* The wording of the definition of "fa'o" must be watched closely to prevent contradictions with ((BPFK Section: Nonce connectives)).<br />
* The selma'o MAI probably requires either preprocessing prior to YACC, or a PEG grammar.<br />
<br />
== Notes ==<br />
<br />
TUhU is currently seldom elidable. I believe that currently it is only elidable at the end of text. It is the belief of .xorxes., me, and possibly others that it should never be elidable. - .aionys.<br />
<br />
NIhO should *NOT* have different uffects depending on the medium it is in. rlpowell agrees. (I don't like how "ni'o"*N resets various things depending on N. Can't tense be reset using KI?) - .djeims./purpleposeidon/neptunepink (+1 check out my notes by the applicable words. -Lindar)<br />
<br />
== Impact ==<br />
<br />
It is my belief that this section does not invalidate actual usages that were<br />
previously valid, nor does it contradict current prescription of the language.<br />
<br />
* Clarification: topic resumption by label applies if no'i has a positive __or zero__ subscript.<br />
* Clarification: topic resumption by back-counting __starts at section before the one currently being introduced__.<br />
* Clarification: the implication that any term in a prenex is either a bound variable or a topic (CLL p. 467) is made explicit.<br />
<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<small> Ported from Tiki by kmir, 20 Jan 2015. Poll was here with 3 responses. </small><br />
-----</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=BPFK_Section:_Text_Structure_cmavo&diff=111137BPFK Section: Text Structure cmavo2015-01-19T14:08:16Z<p>Kmir: </p>
<hr />
<div>== Prior usage and discussion ==<br />
<br />
=== ni'o ===<br />
<br />
Seems to be used mostly parallel to paragraph breaks in natural languages. See<br />
[http://www.lojban.org/],<br />
[http://www.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9312/msg00394.html], and<br />
[http://www.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9107/msg00052.html].<br />
<br />
On IRC, which is indicative of spoken language, this appears to have more of a<br />
meaning of changing the subject. Examples:<br />
[http://www.digitalkingdom.org/lojban/irclog/lojban/2004_06_02-02_21.txt],<br />
[http://www.digitalkingdom.org/lojban/irclog/lojban/2002_05_12--2002_11_28.txt].<br />
<br />
ni'o implicitly cancels some assignments, depending on the number of<br />
consecutive ni'o and whether the text is spoken or written. The following table<br />
is due to CLL pp. 446--447.<br />
<br />
{|<br />
! Number of consecutive ni'o !! Written !! Spoken<br />
|-<br />
| ni'o || no effect || cancel KOhA and GOhA<br />
|-<br />
| ni'oni'o || cancel KOhA and GOhA || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses<br />
|-<br />
| ni'oni'oni'o || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses || cancel KOhA and GOhA and tenses<br />
|}<br />
<br />
==== Examples of ''ni'o'' Usage ====<br />
<br />
<nowiki><br />
A: ni'o mi ca'o kelci lo samselkei<br />
B: .i .ua go'i lo samselkei no'u ma<br />
A: .i go'i la'o gy. Final Fantasy .gy.<br />
B: .i .io mi nelci<br />
A: ni'o mi djica lo nu citka<br />
B: no'i mi djica lo nu jbera fi do<br />
A: .i je'e</nowiki><br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
I did not include a natural example because the usage is wide, varied, and<br />
mostly incorrect between spoken, e-mailed, IRC'd, and written Lojban. It should be used for starting new topics of discussion, which as a by-product also clears KOhA and GOhA as well as sticky tenses (IIRC). It is not a paragraph marker (whitespace can be used for that and nobody said how much whitespace is allowed), it is a topic marker.<br />
<br />
==== Issues ====<br />
<br />
* [https://groups.google.com/group/lojban/tree/browse_frm/month/2008-12/dc259d0ccb79a9d0?hl=en&rnum=51&_done=%2Fgroup%2Flojban%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fmonth%2F2008-12%3Fhl%3Den%26scoring%3Dd%26&scoring=d#doc_935fcdee29329746 Parser related comment. Not sure if currently relevant.]<br />
<br />
== Proposed dictionary entries ==<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: fa'o (FAhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
Unless quoted by "zo" or "lo'u" -- "le'u", turned into a quote delimiter by zoi, or acting as part of a lujvo made by a preceding "zei", marks the end of input to be parsed. Any remaining text is to be disregarded.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {fe'o}<br />
* {fanmo}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* The End.<br />
* parsing ends here<br />
* end parsing here<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
There is no usage other than quotes or jokes in English. The only usage that<br />
could be deemed correct is a single fa'o at the end of the Berenstein Bears<br />
books or other books.<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Described as unconditional end of parsing. Evidently intended only for machine<br />
input. Sometimes used in the sense of "the end". Some erroneous uses, such as<br />
inside of tu'e -- tu'u groups. See<br />
[http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:MpjTKbPZY88J:www.lojban.org/twiki/pub/Files/Documents/carvi.html+%22fa%27o%22+site:.lojban.org&hl=no|1]<br />
I see no reason to legalise this practice, since ''fe'o'' is available for this<br />
purpose.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: i (I) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Starts a new sentence.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {ni'o}<br />
* {no'i}<br />
* {tu'e}<br />
* {fa'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* and then<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
(see ''ni'o'')<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Ubiquitous. This is used mostly in front of sentences that are not the first<br />
sentence in the text. Sometimes also the first sentence in the text is prefixed<br />
with .i. (However, this is incorrect.)%%% It is used to indicate the beginning<br />
of a new jufra continuing on the topic established with ni'o.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: mai (MAI) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Enumerates a point in the text. Combines with the preceding numeral to make a<br />
free modifier, which can be placed almost anywhere in a text.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {mo'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* -stly<br />
* -ndly<br />
* -thly<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
MAI is postfix, this was probably decided to make it analogous to mei, moi,<br />
roi, and re'u. However, this serves to make the grammar of Lojban non-LALR(1),<br />
because the parser may have to look through an arbitrarily large numeral string<br />
to decide that it actually belongs in a free modifier. This should not be a<br />
problem if Robin's PEG parser is made official. If Robin's PEG parser is<br />
''not'' made official, however, extensive pre-processing will be required.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: mo'o (MAI) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Enumerates a higher-level section or chapter in the text. Combines with the<br />
preceding numeral to make a free modifier, which can be placed almost anywhere<br />
in a text.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {mai}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* -st section<br />
* -nd section<br />
* -rd section<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
MAI is postfix, this was probably decided to make it analogous to mei, moi,<br />
roi, and re'u. However, this serves to make the grammar of Lojban non-LALR(1),<br />
because the parser may have to look through an arbitrarily large numeral string<br />
to decide that it actually belongs in a free modifier. This should not be a<br />
problem if Robin's PEG parser is made official. If Robin's PEG parser is<br />
''not'' made official, however, extensive pre-processing will be required.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: ni'o (NIhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the start of a paragraph and a change of subject. Multiple "ni'o" in a row means higher-level section breaks. In written contexts, two or more consecutive "ni'o" cancels the assignment of pro-sumti and pro-bridi in the selma'o KOhA and GOhA, respectively, and three or more consecutive "ni'o" additionally cancels all current tenses. In spoken contexts, a single or several consecutive "ni'o" cancels the assignment of pro-sumti and pro-bridi in the selma'o KOhA and GOhA, respectively, while two or more consecutive "ni'o" additionally cancels all current tenses.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {no'i}<br />
* {i}<br />
* {ta'o}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* continuing to the next topic<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
Artificial:<br />
<nowiki><br />
A: ni'o mi ca'o kelci lo samselkei<br />
B: .i .ua go'i lo samselkei no'u ma<br />
A: .i go'i la'o gy. Final Fantasy .gy.<br />
B: .i .io mi nelci<br />
A: ni'o mi djica lo nu citka<br />
B: no'i mi djica lo nu jbera fi do<br />
A: .i je'e</nowiki><br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: no'i (NIhO) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the start of a paragraph and change back to a previous subject. If no'i has a positive or zero subscript, it indicates the continuation of an earlier topic that was introduced with the word ni'o with the same subscript. If no'i has a negative subscript, it is a resumption of the topic of the paragraph found by counting backwards, starting with the paragraph before the one introduced with ni'o.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {ni'o}<br />
* {i}<br />
* {ta'o nai}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* returning to the previous topic<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
;no'i la xrist. ba cpacu loi vanju mu'i lenu pinxe kei gi'e te preti fo ko'a felenu ko'a djica lenu la xrist. dunda dakau ko'a: ''"Christ then took wine to drink, and asked the man what he wanted Christ to give him."''<br />
From the translation of "Cardplayer", by Nick Nicholas. [http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/cardplayer|2]<br />
<br />
;no'i mi pu co'a mutce kurji lo nu jmina la jbovlaste: ''"Anyway, I take great care about additions to Jbovlaste."'' [http://www.livejournal.com/users/camgusmis/2435.html|3]<br />
<br />
Also see example at {ni'o}.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: tu'e (TUhE) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Starts a text scope, which is a group of sentences. The text scope acts as a single sentence externally, for purposes such as logical operators.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {tu'u}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
Usage is contended. No consistent natural examples exist. Arbitrary examples follow:<br />
<br />
* ro da pa de zo'u tu'e da gerku .ije de mlatu tu'u .inaja da jersi de<br />
<br />
* .i la robin. kakne lo nu djuno tu'e lo se pensi be da<br />
* mi nelci lo nu pilno zo ka'u va'o tu'e le jboklu<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
''tu'e'' - ''tu'u'' seems to be used mainly to be used to set off a large block of text and refer to it metalinguisticially. For instance, there is a (very large) mailing list thread called [http://www.lojban.org/lists/lojban-list/msg03769.html|loi preti be fi lo nincli zo'u tu'e]. Also lots of poetry are prefixed with titles that uses ''di'e'' to refer to the body of the poem, set of with ''tu'e''.<br />
* [http://lojban.org/lists/lojban-list/msg08842.html|Confusion as to the fact that tu'e clauses don't fit into relative clauses]<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: tu'u (TUhU) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Ends a text scope. Elidable terminator for tu'e.<br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
* {tu'e}<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* end of text scope<br />
* terminator<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
See {tu'e}.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
=== cmavo: zo'u (ZOhU) ===<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Definition ====<br />
<br />
Marks the end of a prenex. A prenex can occur at the beginning of the sentence,<br />
and consists of one or more terms. A term is either a sumti or a sumti preceded<br />
by a tense or modal tag. The primary use of a prenex is for quantifying logical<br />
variables prior to their use in the sentence and/or sentences that are joined<br />
to it by a logical connective. Terms that do not quantify logical variables are<br />
instead interpreted as 'topics' of the containing sentence, and any sentences<br />
that are joined to it by a logical connective. <br />
<br />
==== See Also ====<br />
<br />
==== Proposed Keywords ====<br />
<br />
* so that<br />
* such that<br />
<br />
==== Usage Examples ====<br />
<br />
;i lo do solri nu canci zo'u do ba lifri i mi ba mi'ecpe: ''Your sun-like<br />
vanishing exists such that you will experience it. I will demand it.''<br />
<br />
==== Notes ====<br />
<br />
Marks the end of a prenex. A prenex can have one or more terms, which may<br />
constrain the instantiation of logical variables in the main sentence. Prenexes<br />
are also used as a topic field.<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<br />
<br />
== Interaction with other sections ==<br />
<br />
* The wording of the definition of "fa'o" must be watched closely to prevent contradictions with ((BPFK Section: Nonce connectives)).<br />
* The selma'o MAI probably requires either preprocessing prior to YACC, or a PEG grammar.<br />
<br />
== Notes ==<br />
<br />
TUhU is currently seldom elidable. I believe that currently it is only elidable at the end of text. It is the belief of .xorxes., me, and possibly others that it should never be elidable. - .aionys.<br />
<br />
NIhO should *NOT* have different uffects depending on the medium it is in. rlpowell agrees. (I don't like how "ni'o"*N resets various things depending on N. Can't tense be reset using KI?) - .djeims./purpleposeidon/neptunepink (+1 check out my notes by the applicable words. -Lindar)<br />
<br />
== Impact ==<br />
<br />
It is my belief that this section does not invalidate actual usages that were<br />
previously valid, nor does it contradict current prescription of the language.<br />
<br />
* Clarification: topic resumption by label applies if no'i has a positive __or zero__ subscript.<br />
* Clarification: topic resumption by back-counting __starts at section before the one currently being introduced__.<br />
* Clarification: the implication that any term in a prenex is either a bound variable or a topic (CLL p. 467) is made explicit.<br />
<br />
<br />
-----<br />
<small> Ported from Tiki by kmir, 20 Jan 2015. Poll was here with 3 responses. </small><br />
-----</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=UserWiki:Kmir&diff=111062UserWiki:Kmir2015-01-15T20:37:57Z<p>Kmir: import user wiki</p>
<hr />
<div></div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ta%27arvei_ve_cilre&diff=110989ta'arvei ve cilre2015-01-11T10:08:15Z<p>Kmir: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page hosts a collection of short, conversational recordings of spoken lojban, in the style of Pimsleur or other audio-focused language courses. Each dialogue is a short skit pertaining to a certain situation, and is accompanied by a list of relevant vocab words.<br />
<br />
Because this resource is still in development, recordings or translations for each of the dialogues may not be available at this point. If you'd like to assist with completing or expanding this resource, please feel free to contribute to this page.<br />
== Ideas ==<br />
<br />
One thing I noticed about the pimsleur dialogues, which I quite liked from a learner's perspective, is that often they include mistakes and corrections, which could be a useful feature to emulate.<br />
<br />
Also, is it useful to provide literal glosses, like in CLL? I always found those helpful.<br />
== Todo: An audio dialogue resource ==<br />
<br />
* Proof-read and improve kmir's dialogues for naturalness of speech<br />
* Translate borrowed dialogues<br />
* Extract and provide vocab lists for each dialogue.<br />
* Begin recording and uploading dialogues in any order. Preferably with two actors.<br />
== Dialogues ==<br />
<br />
=== kmir's Original Situation Dialogues (incomplete) ===<br />
<br />
# penmi be lo nalslabu prenu<br />
#* .i xu do tavla fo lo glibau<br />
#* .u'u na go'i .i xu do tavla fo le jbobau<br />
#* .i na go'i .i mi tadni<br />
#* .ua ko ca'a cilre di'ai<br />
# xagji<br />
#* .oi mi xagji<br />
#* .i go'iru'e<br />
#* .i ma kukte do<br />
#* lo xindo cidja<br />
#* .a'u mi troci .i xu da vi gusta lo go'i<br />
#* .ie ko kansa mi<br />
# vecnu<br />
#* ju'i (as though calling over a distance)<br />
#* fi'i .i cpedu ma<br />
#* .i li xo jdima ti<br />
#* panono<br />
#* .ue li xanono .i mutce kargu<br />
#* na'i na'i .i lo jdima du li pa , no , no (speaking clearly)<br />
#* .ua.o'u .i mi te vecnu<br />
#* .i ki'e do<br />
# spofu<br />
#* .oi.ai mi pante<br />
#* .u'u.oidai .i pante ma<br />
#* .i ti spofu<br />
#* .i za'a ti to'e spofu<br />
#* .i li'a ti poi pagbu cu spofu<br />
#* .i ua do drani .i mi'a basygau<br />
# penmi lo skepre<br />
#* X: doi .bab. e'o penmi lo pendo be mi<br />
#* A: coi mi'e la .alis. .i ma do cmene<br />
#* B: coi .alis. mi'e la bab .i do se jibri ma<br />
#* A: .i mi skepre be lo xamsi<br />
#* B: .u'e manci .i mi puzuku djica lo ka binxo lo xamsi skepre <br />
# co'a jibri<br />
#* fi'i doi do<br />
#* ki'e .i mi milxe xanka<br />
#* ba lo nu sanmi ku .ai mi pengau do ro da<br />
#* .ui .i mi facki ta'i ma lo du'u ma kau mi se briju<br />
#* .i mi jarco<br />
# vitke mi<br />
#* xu do djica lo ka vitke<br />
#* .ie.ui<br />
#* .ai.e'o ma'a zgana lo skina<br />
#* .i xamgu sidbo<br />
#* .i mi nelci lo tepyskina uipei<br />
#* .oiro'o .i mi to'e nelci mutce<br />
# vi lo barja ku<br />
#* coi ro do .i mi zvati .ui<br />
#* .iesai .i penmi .ui<br />
#* .i xu ro do pu te vecnu lo se pinxe<br />
#* .i .ai mi do dunda be lo pa birje ku noi do nelci<br />
#* .ue prane ki'esai<br />
# mabla tcini<br />
#* do mo pei<br />
#* mi badri .uinai<br />
#* ki'u ma<br />
#* .i mi dejni<br />
#* .ua<br />
#* .ije lo mi mlatu cu bilma<br />
#* .ue<br />
#* .ije lo mi speni cu fengu<br />
#* .u'esai mabla tcini<br />
#* .iesaipei<br />
# na'e birti<br />
#* .ue ti kukte<br />
#* .iesai<br />
#* ta'i ma do ba'o co'a se slabu lo vi gusta<br />
#* ju'ocu'i mi tcidu fi le kibypapri poi .yyyy.<br />
#* .ua le crino xu<br />
#* .ienai na crino .yyyyy. ... .i .u'u mi na morji<br />
#* .oi je'u do bebna zo'o<br />
# lerci<br />
#* coi do .i xu lerci fa lo nu mi darca<br />
#* na go'i .i bazi co'a nunpe'i<br />
#* ba lo be li xo mentu<br />
#* li re<br />
#* .ii co'osai <!-- huh?? --><br />
<br />
=== Dialogues From Spanish by Choice (to be translated) ===<br />
<br />
# Activity: Getting ready<br />
#* Are you ready yet?<br />
#* Wait a moment!<br />
#* Relax! We still have time.<br />
#* Good.<br />
# Activity: Asking to go out<br />
#* Hello! Are you going to the party?<br />
#* What party?<br />
#* Javier's birthday party.<br />
#* Sure I'm going to go. Shall we go together?<br />
# Food: Order a drink<br />
#* Good afternoon. What can I serve you?<br />
#* I'd like a beer.<br />
#* Regular or dark?<br />
#* Dark, please.<br />
# Asking for a name<br />
#* How does your Mexican friend call herself?<br />
#* She calls herself Tatiana. But she is not Mexcian. She is Guatemalan.<br />
#* Really? From what part of Guatemala?<br />
#* From Antigua.<br />
# Asking for a favour<br />
#* Miss!<br />
#* Yes?<br />
#* Excuse me, could you please take a picture for us?<br />
#* How could I not? Smile!<br />
#* Thanks.<br />
# small talk: greetings<br />
#* Hello, beautiful! How is it going for you?<br />
#* Good, good. And you, how are you?<br />
#* Everything's fine, thanks.<br />
#* That makes me happy.<br />
# small talk: country of birth<br />
#* Where are you from?<br />
#* I'm from Peru. And you?<br />
#* I'm from Colombia.<br />
#* How nice!<br />
# asking: for a translation<br />
#* Hey! How do you say internet in Spanish?<br />
#* You say internet.<br />
#* The same as in English?<br />
#* Yes, the same.<br />
# leisure: planning to go out<br />
#* I'm hungry.<br />
#* Me too. Are we going to eat?<br />
#* Yes, I want to go to a Italian restaurant.<br />
#* Good idea.<br />
# small talk: saying good bye<br />
#* We see each other tomorrow, right?<br />
#* At what time?<br />
#* Let's see. I don't know. Call me later.<br />
#* OK, see you tomorrow.<br />
# at home: searching<br />
#* I'm going to wash clothes. Is there detergent?<br />
#* Yes, there is, downstairs in the kitchen.<br />
#* Where? In what part?<br />
#* I don't know. Look for it.<br />
# leisure: being seated<br />
#* Table for two, if you are so kind.<br />
#* Do you have a reservation?<br />
#* No, I don't.<br />
#* It doesn't matter. Follow me please.<br />
# health: stomach ache<br />
#* Man, what's happening to you?<br />
#* I don't feel so good.<br />
#* What's wrong with you?<br />
#* My stomach hurts.<br />
#* Poor guy.<br />
# asking: a question<br />
#* I have a question.<br />
#* Tell me!<br />
#* How do you write beige?<br />
#* The color? You write it with b as in Bob, e, i, g, e.<br />
#* Thanks.<br />
# leisure: not going out<br />
#* Do you want to go out today?<br />
#* No, I prefer to stay at home.<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* I'm sleepy.<br />
#* Too bad. We see each other tomorrow.<br />
# food: buying apples<br />
#* Good afternoon. Will you give me a kilo of apples?<br />
#* Green apples or red ones?<br />
#* Green, please.<br />
#* Anything else?<br />
#* No, that's all. Thanks.<br />
# small talk: neighborhood<br />
#* Here comes the neighbor.<br />
#* Do you know him?<br />
#* No, I don't know him. How about you?<br />
#* Me neither.<br />
# small talk: phone calls<br />
#* Hello?<br />
#* Is Mauricio in?<br />
#* No, he's not in. Call him back later.<br />
#* Fine. Thanks.<br />
# small talk: disbelief<br />
#* My rent is at a thousand dollars.<br />
#* Seriously? It's very expensive.<br />
#* But everything is expensive.<br />
#* You're right.<br />
# in public: in the bathroom<br />
#* It's busy.<br />
#* Oh, sorry. (formal)<br />
#* There's no problem. You can go in. (formal)<br />
# at home: commanding<br />
#* Sh! Don't make noise!<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* The baby is sleeping.<br />
#* Don't worry.<br />
# leisure: toasting<br />
#* Take a drink!<br />
#* What are we toasting to?<br />
#* To my new job.<br />
#* Congratulations!<br />
#* Cheers!<br />
#* Cheers!<br />
# food: drinking coffee<br />
#* Hey! Do you want a coffee?<br />
#* Of course yes.<br />
#* Black or with milk?<br />
#* With a little bit of milk, please.<br />
# food: smelling cookies<br />
#* It smells good.<br />
#* Yes, it's my cookies.<br />
#* How delicious!<br />
#* Careful, they're hot!<br />
# asking: for the time<br />
#* At what time does our train leave?<br />
#* At three o'clock in the afternoon.<br />
#* And what time is it?<br />
#* It's two forty.<br />
#* Hurry up! Run!<br />
# in public: banking<br />
#* I want to make a deposit.<br />
#* Fill out this form!<br />
#* Do you loan me your pen?<br />
#* Of course.<br />
# food: ordering water<br />
#* What shall I give you?<br />
#* Will you give me a bottle of water, please?<br />
#* Carbonated water or non-carbonated water?<br />
#* Non-carbonated because it gives me gas.<br />
#* I'll give it to you right away.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# small talk: networking<br />
#* It's been my pleasure.<br />
#* Likewise.<br />
#* Can you give me your e-mail?<br />
#* I'll better give you my business card.<br />
# health: jet-lag<br />
#* I have jet-lag.<br />
#* What's that?<br />
#* The change of time zone.<br />
#* Oh, of course, because here it's eight hours ahead.<br />
#* True.<br />
# small talk: introducing oneself<br />
#* Hi! What is your name?<br />
#* My name is Antonia. And you?<br />
#* I'm Roberto.<br />
#* Nice to meet you.<br />
#* It's a pleasure.<br />
# small talk: in a relation?<br />
#* Are you single?<br />
#* No. I have a boyfriend.<br />
#* What? — What a pity!<br />
#* And you? Are you single?<br />
#* Yes.<br />
#* A pity...<br />
# asking: for one's age<br />
#* How old are you?<br />
#* I'm thirty years old.<br />
#* You seem younger.<br />
#* Thanks a lot.<br />
# health: allergies<br />
#* I want the chocolate cake.<br />
#* That's fine.<br />
#* Does the cake have nuts?<br />
#* No, it doesn't have any.<br />
#* Are you sure? Because I am allergic.<br />
# asking: for the bathroom<br />
#* Excuse me! Where is the bathroom?<br />
#* The second door on the right.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
#* You're welcome.<br />
# food: ordering a hamburger<br />
#* Do you have room service?<br />
#* We do have it.<br />
#* I want a hamburger.<br />
#* I bring it to you in 10 minutes.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# asking: for a phone number<br />
#* What's your phone number?<br />
#* My cell phone number is 6-5-2-12-56-56.<br />
#* OK, I call you at night.<br />
#* Great.<br />
# health: bad breadth<br />
#* Do you want a mint?<br />
#* Why? Does my mouth stink?<br />
#* Yes, take this!<br />
# asking: to buy something<br />
#* Will you give me a phone card?<br />
#* For domestic or international calls?<br />
#* International calls.<br />
#* Ten euros.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# leisure: flirting<br />
#* Look at her! She is flirting.<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* She looks at you and she smiles.<br />
#* Perfect! I'm going to talk with her.<br />
# health: homesickness<br />
#* What's happening to you?<br />
#* I miss my family.<br />
#* Call them!<br />
#* Good idea.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=zbalermorna&diff=110768zbalermorna2014-12-25T12:06:47Z<p>Kmir: Remove outdated resources, reformat intro page to present documentation options more clearly</p>
<hr />
<div>[[File:display5.png]] <br />
<br />
In 2014 I finally got around to releasing the finalised documentation for this system. It is readable here: <br />
* [[:File:ZLM4_Writeup_v2.pdf|Downloadable PDF]] <br />
<br />
* [https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B0aL1oAS_j4yZjZKa3ZYYUNUdnVZdHdEMW5pMGdJUQ Public google docs] <br />
<br />
==== Discussion ====<br />
Most developmental discussion occurred on jbotcan across several months.<br />
*http://jbotcan.org/ideas/res/284.html</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=srilermorna&diff=110767srilermorna2014-12-25T11:56:38Z<p>Kmir: Typo'd my wiki markup</p>
<hr />
<div>__NOTOC__<br />
<center>[[Image:srilermorna.png]]</center><br />
<br />
== la srilermornar. ==<br />
<br />
The script was originally intended to be written without lifting your pen, however it was found that creating enough permutations of unbroken lines to fill Lojban's 25 letter alphabet became stupidly complex very quickly. Thus began experimentation with simple ways of looping, breaking and bending lines, producing 23 unique letters, which were gradually stripped down to 18 unique symbols, the rest completed with the diacritic flick.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriMainChart.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Chart of the main Lojban lerfu =====<br />
<br />
=== How to read srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
==== The Flick ====<br />
<br />
Srilermorna has one diacritic mark, the flick. The flick represents vocalisation in the pairs ty./dy., ky./gy., fy./vy. and py./by.. It also marries the pairs ly./ry. and ny./my., where it does not strictly represent vocalisation but simply pairs similar sounds.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriFlick.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Marking with the diacritic flick =====<br />
<br />
==== Stops ====<br />
<br />
The denpa bu, stop or 'dot' in Lojban has two incarnations in srilermorna, a prefix version and a suffix version. In accordance with its role in spoken Lojban, the stop 'stops' the continuing line of a word. In the case of a prestop, as used in attitudinals and connectives, it begins the line with a small vertical stroke from half height above the baseline, and a poststop, used in cmene, is the same but downwards from the baseline, to half-height below, ending the line.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriStop.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Using pre- and poststops in srilermorna text =====<br />
<br />
In addition to these, another, very specific stop is used in transcribing proper names, the comma. The srilermorna comma looks like this:<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriComma.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
<center>and functions as normal, example</center><br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriPier.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
==== Stress Notation ====<br />
<br />
Irregular stress, indicated in the latin system with capital letters, is notated in srilermorna by a straight, horizontal bar which sits above the irregular syllable.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriStressing.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
=== How to write srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriHandwritten.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== An example of handwritten srilermorna, on lined and square paper =====<br />
<br />
Srilermorna letters tend form more cleanly when the pen is moving quite quickly.<br />
<br />
When writing on lined refill, the recommended method is to use two lanes per line of text, using the blue line in the centre as the baseline.<br />
<br />
==== Spacing: ====<br />
<br />
Although not vital to the legibility of a text, accurate spacing is a surprisingly big part of srilermorna's overall aesthetic. Cramped letters become cluttered and messy, although not necessarily unreadable. All letters should be roughly evenly spaced, including spaces. The writer might imagine a grid in which one box fits a single letter.<br />
<br />
==== Calligraphy: ====<br />
<br />
As evidenced in the computerised lettering above, the script is takes its style from calligraphic strokes using a broad tipped pen. A paintbrush or brush-tipped felt pen also works well, and calligraphic writing recreates the aesthetic effect intended by the script. This form is suited to presentation of poetry, art or other artistic media.<br />
<br />
===== About letter breaking: =====<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBreaking.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
Optionally, the writer can 'break' a marked, looped consonant in order to write the diacritic flick without having to backtrack over their finished word. The letters cy., jy., zy., ry. gy. and dy. already involve lifting the pen from the paper so do not present an issue. It is the writer's discretion whether he or she prefers breaking or backtracking in their writing.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBacktrack.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
=== How to type srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
==== Get the font ====<br />
[[:File:srilermorna.ttf|Download TTF font]]<br />
<br />
==== Layout ====<br />
<br />
Typed srilermorna spaces itself, and lends itself equally well to center or left-side alignment, but due to the strict regular spacing, should not be justified lest the lines break.<br />
<br />
==== Keyboard mapping ====<br />
<br />
The script is implemented as a truetype font over the latin character set. Therefore it should be totally cross-platform and map directly to any western keyboard configuration. It does not have any special input method, save for the following features:<br />
<br />
* Prestop and poststop: these are both typed with the period (.) key and should configure themselves while typing. a period will default to a prestop unless folowed by a space, where it will automatically convert.<br />
* Forcing poststops: A period can be forced to a poststop in the absence of a space by following it with a grave (`). This is sometimes necessary at the end of a line or inside cmene strings.<br />
<br />
* Forcing a break for by, vy and my: To type the broken version of by, vy or my, follow it with grave (`).<br />
* Note: Using the ` grave symbol to force poststops and type broken letters does not remove the presence of the grave symbol in the text, it is merely invisible. This allows simple ascii copy-pastes to render correctly. For example: <br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBavmiGrave.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
* .y'y maps to both the ' key and the h key.<br />
* Characters which aren't covered by the font (like numerals, brackets etc) usually default to some latin font, depending on the system. Exceptions to this are Q, q, W, w and grave, all of which have the same symbol, a blank space with no width, so they render as invisible.<br />
<br />
* Stress bars map to capital letters, making traditional stress notation compatible.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=srilermorna&diff=110766srilermorna2014-12-25T11:55:39Z<p>Kmir: Remove links to development versions of srilermorna</p>
<hr />
<div>__NOTOC__<br />
<center>[[Image:srilermorna.png]]</center><br />
<br />
== la srilermornar. ==<br />
<br />
The script was originally intended to be written without lifting your pen, however it was found that creating enough permutations of unbroken lines to fill Lojban's 25 letter alphabet became stupidly complex very quickly. Thus began experimentation with simple ways of looping, breaking and bending lines, producing 23 unique letters, which were gradually stripped down to 18 unique symbols, the rest completed with the diacritic flick.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriMainChart.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Chart of the main Lojban lerfu =====<br />
<br />
=== How to read srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
==== The Flick ====<br />
<br />
Srilermorna has one diacritic mark, the flick. The flick represents vocalisation in the pairs ty./dy., ky./gy., fy./vy. and py./by.. It also marries the pairs ly./ry. and ny./my., where it does not strictly represent vocalisation but simply pairs similar sounds.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriFlick.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Marking with the diacritic flick =====<br />
<br />
==== Stops ====<br />
<br />
The denpa bu, stop or 'dot' in Lojban has two incarnations in srilermorna, a prefix version and a suffix version. In accordance with its role in spoken Lojban, the stop 'stops' the continuing line of a word. In the case of a prestop, as used in attitudinals and connectives, it begins the line with a small vertical stroke from half height above the baseline, and a poststop, used in cmene, is the same but downwards from the baseline, to half-height below, ending the line.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriStop.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== Using pre- and poststops in srilermorna text =====<br />
<br />
In addition to these, another, very specific stop is used in transcribing proper names, the comma. The srilermorna comma looks like this:<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriComma.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
<center>and functions as normal, example</center><br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriPier.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
==== Stress Notation ====<br />
<br />
Irregular stress, indicated in the latin system with capital letters, is notated in srilermorna by a straight, horizontal bar which sits above the irregular syllable.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriStressing.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
=== How to write srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriHandwritten.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
===== An example of handwritten srilermorna, on lined and square paper =====<br />
<br />
Srilermorna letters tend form more cleanly when the pen is moving quite quickly.<br />
<br />
When writing on lined refill, the recommended method is to use two lanes per line of text, using the blue line in the centre as the baseline.<br />
<br />
==== Spacing: ====<br />
<br />
Although not vital to the legibility of a text, accurate spacing is a surprisingly big part of srilermorna's overall aesthetic. Cramped letters become cluttered and messy, although not necessarily unreadable. All letters should be roughly evenly spaced, including spaces. The writer might imagine a grid in which one box fits a single letter.<br />
<br />
==== Calligraphy: ====<br />
<br />
As evidenced in the computerised lettering above, the script is takes its style from calligraphic strokes using a broad tipped pen. A paintbrush or brush-tipped felt pen also works well, and calligraphic writing recreates the aesthetic effect intended by the script. This form is suited to presentation of poetry, art or other artistic media.<br />
<br />
===== About letter breaking: =====<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBreaking.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
Optionally, the writer can 'break' a marked, looped consonant in order to write the diacritic flick without having to backtrack over their finished word. The letters cy., jy., zy., ry. gy. and dy. already involve lifting the pen from the paper so do not present an issue. It is the writer's discretion whether he or she prefers breaking or backtracking in their writing.<br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBacktrack.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
=== How to type srilermorna ===<br />
<br />
==== Get the font ===<br />
<br />
[[:File:srilermorna.ttf|Download TTF font]]<br />
<br />
==== Layout ====<br />
<br />
Typed srilermorna spaces itself, and lends itself equally well to center or left-side alignment, but due to the strict regular spacing, should not be justified lest the lines break.<br />
<br />
==== Keyboard mapping ====<br />
<br />
The script is implemented as a truetype font over the latin character set. Therefore it should be totally cross-platform and map directly to any western keyboard configuration. It does not have any special input method, save for the following features:<br />
<br />
* Prestop and poststop: these are both typed with the period (.) key and should configure themselves while typing. a period will default to a prestop unless folowed by a space, where it will automatically convert.<br />
* Forcing poststops: A period can be forced to a poststop in the absence of a space by following it with a grave (`). This is sometimes necessary at the end of a line or inside cmene strings.<br />
<br />
* Forcing a break for by, vy and my: To type the broken version of by, vy or my, follow it with grave (`).<br />
* Note: Using the ` grave symbol to force poststops and type broken letters does not remove the presence of the grave symbol in the text, it is merely invisible. This allows simple ascii copy-pastes to render correctly. For example: <br />
<br />
<center>[[Image:sriBavmiGrave.PNG]]</center><br />
<br />
* .y'y maps to both the ' key and the h key.<br />
* Characters which aren't covered by the font (like numerals, brackets etc) usually default to some latin font, depending on the system. Exceptions to this are Q, q, W, w and grave, all of which have the same symbol, a blank space with no width, so they render as invisible.<br />
<br />
* Stress bars map to capital letters, making traditional stress notation compatible.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=Alternate_orthographies&diff=110765Alternate orthographies2014-12-25T11:39:35Z<p>Kmir: Change reference to kmir's work under 'original scripts' to point to specific final versions of SLM and ZLM pages</p>
<hr />
<div>{{See_also|Lojban Ideography}}<br />
{{See_also|Technical Issues With Alternate Orthographies}}<br />
== Latin ==<br />
*A [[Loglan]]-compatible orthography for the purposes of reapproachment with the [[TLI|TLI]] has been proposed<ref>http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9602/msg00071.html</ref>. Since the reapproachment never eventuated, the proposal is in limbo.<br />
*[[And Rosta]] is notorious for using (but only prior to the baseline and publication of [[Codex Woldemar|Woldy]]!) and [[User:Mark Shoulson|Mark Shoulson]] is still sympathetic to, [[apostropheless alternative orthographies]].<br />
*It's been proposed to use acute ('''´''') and grave ('''`''') accent marks instead of those ugly capitals in order to mark stress. It's not ASCII, but it's still Latin-1<br />
*[[Capitals as letter names]]<br />
*[[Lojban calligraphy|Lojban calligraphy]]<br />
<br />
== Extant Scripts ==<br />
* [[Hanzi orthography]]<br />
* [[The Book|CLL]] describes a Cyrillic orthography for Lojban, devised by [[Ivan Derzhanski|Ivan Derzhanski]]. The equivalences are as you'd expect; '''y''' is represented by ъ (the hard sign, as in Bulgarian). As originally designed, '''<nowiki>'</nowiki>''' was represented by ь (the soft sign), but in the Book '''<nowiki>'</nowiki>''' is used unchanged. Period and comma are also unchanged.<br />
*[[Hebrew Orthography]] by [[Adam]] & [[.aulun.]] finally based on Yiddish writing conventions (proving to be best for Lojban).<br />
*[[Arabic Orthography|Arabic Orthography]]<ref>http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/1fe6b70c875c3a2b</ref> by [[.filip.]] <br />
*orthography for [[estrangela]] by [[.kreig.daniyl.]]<br />
*A [[Katakana Orthography|Katakana]] orthography is being mooted.<br />
** About to lose his last sense for rationality, [[.aulun.]] pondered about a [[Hiragana|Hiragana]] script for Lojban.<br />
** Katakana and Hiragana could be mixed too which would be even more weird<br />
*[[Mongolian|Mongolian]] orthography<br />
* [[Manchu orthography|Manchu]] orthography<br />
*[[Devanagari orthography|Devanagari]] orthography<br />
*[[Hangul|Hangul]] orthography<br />
*[[Georgian Orthography|Georgian ]]<nowiki/>orthography<br />
*[[jbopomofo|jbopomofo]]<br />
<br />
== Fictional Scripts ==<br />
*The [http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/u/relipper/tolkien/rootpage.html Tolkien] script [http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/4948/tengwar/index.htm Tengwar] has been [[Tengwar|proposed as another way of writing Lojban]]. The proposal originally came from prominent ex-Lojbanist [http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/ Eric Raymond], which has made its repute spread far and wide.<br />
**"[[Why Tengwar?]]", a discussion on whether this is a Good Thing.<br />
*[[Apollonian alphabet|Apollonian alphabet]]<br />
*[[Verdurian orthography|Verdurian orthography]] by [[pne|pne]]<br />
<br />
== Original Scripts ==<br />
*[[srilermorna]] noi se finti la [[User:Kmir|kmir]]<br />
* [[zbalermorna]] noi se finti la [[User:Kmir|kmir]]<br />
*[http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/9a0a9c276e6f8f1f larlermorna] by [[User:Lindar|Lindar]]<br />
*[https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AiofPj-7nZpwdHppa3oxU2hGUDdQSWxmZDhaWTdBaUE&hl=en&authkey=CJyrpOQD Ctino's version] of [http://www.ccelian.com/ElianScriptFull.html Elian script]<br />
<br />
== Related silliness ==<br />
* [[R2D2 Lojban]]<br />
* [[Proper Lojban Orthography|Proper Lojban Orthography]]<br />
==References==<br />
<references /></div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=ta%27arvei_ve_cilre&diff=110631ta'arvei ve cilre2014-12-22T14:43:55Z<p>Kmir: Created page with "This page hosts a collection of short, conversational recordings of spoken lojban, in the style of Pimsleur or other audio-focused language courses. Each dialogue is a short s..."</p>
<hr />
<div>This page hosts a collection of short, conversational recordings of spoken<br />
lojban, in the style of Pimsleur or other audio-focused language courses. Each<br />
dialogue is a short skit pertaining to a certain situation, and is accompanied<br />
by a list of relevant vocab words.<br />
<br />
Because this resource is still in development, recordings or translations for<br />
each of the dialogues may not be available at this point. If you'd like to<br />
assist with completing or expanding this resource, please feel free to<br />
contribute to this page.<br />
<br />
<br />
== Ideas ==<br />
<br />
gleki:<br />
<br />
in every new lessons there should be two dialogues. the first is a modified<br />
version of the new one from the previous lesson mixed with words from even<br />
earlier lessons + a completely new situation<br />
<br />
kmir:<br />
<br />
one thing i noticed about pimsleur dialogues, which I quite liked from a<br />
learner's perspective, is that often they include mistakes and corrections<br />
could be a useful feature to emulate<br />
<br />
<br />
== Todo: An audio dialogue resource ==<br />
<br />
* Proof-read and improve kmir's dialogues for naturalness of speech<br />
* Translate borrowed dialogues<br />
* Extract and provide vocab lists for each dialogue.<br />
* Begin recording and uploading dialogues in any order. Preferably with two actors.<br />
<br />
=== Future: a Pimsleur-style audio lesson format ===<br />
<br />
* Try to order the dialogues into some kind of procession, with common vocab words between each. This reintroduces previous vocab as mentioned by gleki in the above notes.<br />
* Create alternate versions of each dialogue to act as the revision step of the next lesson (see gleki's note). Alternate versions should deliberately include vocab from previous lessons for repetition learning.<br />
* Record alternate dialogues<br />
* A narrator? In Pimsleur, the narrator guides the listener on a breakdown of a dialogue they have listened to. Sentances are reapproached from various angles to create oral drills.<br />
* Record the narrator if desired, leave gaps for listener out-loud response.<br />
* Compile into a full audio-lesson resource and release.<br />
<br />
<br />
== Dialogues ==<br />
<br />
=== kmir's Original Situation Dialogues (incompete) ===<br />
<br />
# penmi lo ninpre<br />
#* .i xu do tavla fo lo glibau<br />
#* .u'u na go'i .i xu do tavla fo la jbobau<br />
#* .i na go'i .i mi tadni<br />
#* .ua ko ca'a cilre di'ai<br />
# xagji<br />
#* .oi mi xagji<br />
#* .i go'iru'e<br />
#* .i ma kukte do<br />
#* lo xindo cidja<br />
#* .a'u mi troci .i xu da stuzi cu diklo vi<br />
#* .ie ko kansa mi<br />
# vecnu<br />
#* doi do (as thought calling over a distance)<br />
#* fi'i .i spedu ma<br />
#* .i xo jdima ti<br />
#* panono<br />
#* .ue li xanono .i mutce kargu<br />
#* na'i na'i li pa - no - no<br />
#* .ua.o'u .i mi te vecnu<br />
# spofu<br />
#* .oi.ai mi pante<br />
#* .u'u.oidai .i ki'u ma<br />
#* .i ti spofu<br />
#* .i za'a ta to'e spofu<br />
#* .i [obviously!] ti pagbu cu spofu<br />
#* .i ua do drani .i mi'a basygau<br />
# penmi lo skepre<br />
#* X: doi .bab. e'o ko penmi lo pendo be mi<br />
#* A: coi .mi'e la .alis. .i do cmene ma<br />
#* B: coi .alis. mi'e la bab .i do se jibri ma<br />
#* A: .i mi xamsi skepre<br />
#* B: .u'e mi manci<br />
# co'a jibri<br />
#* fi'i doi do<br />
#* ki'e<br />
#* ba lo nu sanmi kei ku .ai mi pengau do ro da<br />
#* .ui .i mi facki ta'i ma lo du'u lo stizu be lo mi briju<br />
#* .i mi jarco<br />
# vitke mi<br />
#* xu do djica lo ka vitke<br />
#* .ie.ui<br />
#* .ai.e'o ma'a zgana lo skina<br />
#* .i xamgu sidbo<br />
#* .i mi nelci lo tepyskina uipei<br />
#* .oiro'o .i mi mutce na nelci<br />
# vi lo barja ku<br />
#* coi ro do .i mi zvati .ui<br />
#* .iesai .i penmi .ui<br />
#* .i xu ro do pu te vecnu lo se pinxe<br />
#* .i mi ba dunda do lo pa birje noi lo nu do nelci<br />
#* .ue prane ki'esai<br />
# mabla tcini<br />
#* do pei<br />
#* .uinai mi badri<br />
#* ki'u ma<br />
#* .i mi dejni<br />
#* .ua<br />
#* .ije lo mi mlatu cu bilma<br />
#* .ue<br />
#* .ije lo mi speni cu fengu<br />
#* .u'esai mabla tcini<br />
#* .iecaipei<br />
# na'e birti<br />
#* .ue ti kukte<br />
#* .iesai<br />
#* [ how did you come to know this restaurant ]<br />
#* .ju'ocu'i mi tcidu le kibrpapri poi .yyyy.<br />
#* .ua le crino xu<br />
#* .ienai na crino .yyyyy. ... .u'u mi na morji<br />
#* .oi je'u do bebna zo'o<br />
# lerci<br />
#* coi do .i xu lerci fa lo nu mi tsuku<br />
#* na go'i .i baze'i co'a nunpe'i<br />
#* xo mentu<br />
#* re mentu<br />
#* .ii co'osai<br />
<br />
=== Dialogues From Spanish by Choice (to be translated) ===<br />
<br />
# Activity: Getting ready<br />
#* Are you ready yet?<br />
#* Wait a moment!<br />
#* Relax! We still have time.<br />
#* Good.<br />
# Activity: Asking to go out<br />
#* Hello! Are you going to the party?<br />
#* What party?<br />
#* Javier's birthday party.<br />
#* Sure I'm going to go. Shall we go together?<br />
# Food: Order a drink<br />
#* Good afternoon. What can I serve you?<br />
#* I'd like a beer.<br />
#* Regular or dark?<br />
#* Dark, please.<br />
# Asking for a name<br />
#* How does your Mexican friend call herself?<br />
#* She calls herself Tatiana. But she is not Mexcian. She is Guatemalan.<br />
#* Really? From what part of Guatemala?<br />
#* From Antigua.<br />
# Asking for a favour<br />
#* Miss!<br />
#* Yes?<br />
#* Excuse me, could you please take a picture for us?<br />
#* How could I not? Smile!<br />
#* Thanks.<br />
# small talk: greetings<br />
#* Hello, beautiful! How is it going for you?<br />
#* Good, good. And you, how are you?<br />
#* Everything's fine, thanks.<br />
#* That makes me happy.<br />
# small talk: country of birth<br />
#* Where are you from?<br />
#* I'm from Peru. And you?<br />
#* I'm from Colombia.<br />
#* How nice!<br />
# asking: for a translation<br />
#* Hey! How do you say internet in Spanish?<br />
#* You say internet.<br />
#* The same as in English?<br />
#* Yes, the same.<br />
# leisure: planning to go out<br />
#* I'm hungry.<br />
#* Me too. Are we going to eat?<br />
#* Yes, I want to go to a Italian restaurant.<br />
#* Good idea.<br />
# small talk: saying good bye<br />
#* We see each other tomorrow, right?<br />
#* At what time?<br />
#* Let's see. I don't know. Call me later.<br />
#* OK, see you tomorrow.<br />
# at home: searching<br />
#* I'm going to wash clothes. Is there detergent?<br />
#* Yes, there is, downstairs in the kitchen.<br />
#* Where? In what part?<br />
#* I don't know. Look for it.<br />
# leisure: being seated<br />
#* Table for two, if you are so kind.<br />
#* Do you have a reservation?<br />
#* No, I don't.<br />
#* It doesn't matter. Follow me please.<br />
# health: stomach ache<br />
#* Man, what's happening to you?<br />
#* I don't feel so good.<br />
#* What's wrong with you?<br />
#* My stomach hurts.<br />
#* Poor guy.<br />
# asking: a question<br />
#* I have a question.<br />
#* Tell me!<br />
#* How do you write beige?<br />
#* The color? You write it with b as in Bob, e, i, g, e.<br />
#* Thanks.<br />
# leisure: not going out<br />
#* Do you want to go out today?<br />
#* No, I prefer to stay at home.<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* I'm sleepy.<br />
#* Too bad. We see each other tomorrow.<br />
# food: buying apples<br />
#* Good afternoon. Will you give me a kilo of apples?<br />
#* Green apples or red ones?<br />
#* Green, please.<br />
#* Anything else?<br />
#* No, that's all. Thanks.<br />
# small talk: neighborhood<br />
#* Here comes the neighbor.<br />
#* Do you know him?<br />
#* No, I don't know him. How about you?<br />
#* Me neither.<br />
# small talk: phone calls<br />
#* Hello?<br />
#* Is Mauricio in?<br />
#* No, he's not in. Call him back later.<br />
#* Fine. Thanks.<br />
# small talk: disbelief<br />
#* My rent is at a thousand dollars.<br />
#* Seriously? It's very expensive.<br />
#* But everything is expensive.<br />
#* You're right.<br />
# in public: in the bathroom<br />
#* It's busy.<br />
#* Oh, sorry. (formal)<br />
#* There's no problem. You can go in. (formal)<br />
# at home: commanding<br />
#* Sh! Don't make noise!<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* The baby is sleeping.<br />
#* Don't worry.<br />
# leisure: toasting<br />
#* Take a drink!<br />
#* What are we toasting to?<br />
#* To my new job.<br />
#* Congratulations!<br />
#* Cheers!<br />
#* Cheers!<br />
# food: drinking coffee<br />
#* Hey! Do you want a coffee?<br />
#* Of course yes.<br />
#* Black or with milk?<br />
#* With a little bit of milk, please.<br />
# food: smelling cookies<br />
#* It smells good.<br />
#* Yes, it's my cookies.<br />
#* How delicious!<br />
#* Careful, they're hot!<br />
# asking: for the time<br />
#* At what time does our train leave?<br />
#* At three o'clock in the afternoon.<br />
#* And what time is it?<br />
#* It's two forty.<br />
#* Hurry up! Run!<br />
# in public: banking<br />
#* I want to make a deposit.<br />
#* Fill out this form!<br />
#* Do you loan me your pen?<br />
#* Of course.<br />
# food: ordering water<br />
#* What shall I give you?<br />
#* Will you give me a bottle of water, please?<br />
#* Carbonated water or non-carbonated water?<br />
#* Non-carbonated because it gives me gas.<br />
#* I'll give it to you right away.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# small talk: networking<br />
#* It's been my pleasure.<br />
#* Likewise.<br />
#* Can you give me your e-mail?<br />
#* I'll better give you my business card.<br />
# health: jet-lag<br />
#* I have jet-lag.<br />
#* What's that?<br />
#* The change of time zone.<br />
#* Oh, of course, because here it's eight hours ahead.<br />
#* True.<br />
# small talk: introducing oneself<br />
#* Hi! What is your name?<br />
#* My name is Antonia. And you?<br />
#* I'm Roberto.<br />
#* Nice to meet you.<br />
#* It's a pleasure.<br />
# small talk: in a relation?<br />
#* Are you single?<br />
#* No. I have a boyfriend.<br />
#* What? — What a pity!<br />
#* And you? Are you single?<br />
#* Yes.<br />
#* A pity...<br />
# asking: for one's age<br />
#* How old are you?<br />
#* I'm thirty years old.<br />
#* You seem younger.<br />
#* Thanks a lot.<br />
# health: allergies<br />
#* I want the chocolate cake.<br />
#* That's fine.<br />
#* Does the cake have nuts?<br />
#* No, it doesn't have any.<br />
#* Are you sure? Because I am allergic.<br />
# asking: for the bathroom<br />
#* Excuse me! Where is the bathroom?<br />
#* The second door on the right.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
#* You're welcome.<br />
# food: ordering a hamburger<br />
#* Do you have room service?<br />
#* We do have it.<br />
#* I want a hamburger.<br />
#* I bring it to you in 10 minutes.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# asking: for a phone number<br />
#* What's your phone number?<br />
#* My cell phone number is 6-5-2-12-56-56.<br />
#* OK, I call you at night.<br />
#* Great.<br />
# health: bad breadth<br />
#* Do you want a mint?<br />
#* Why? Does my mouth stink?<br />
#* Yes, take this!<br />
# asking: to buy something<br />
#* Will you give me a phone card?<br />
#* For domestic or international calls?<br />
#* International calls.<br />
#* Ten euros.<br />
#* Thank you.<br />
# leisure: flirting<br />
#* Look at her! She is flirting.<br />
#* Why?<br />
#* She looks at you and she smiles.<br />
#* Perfect! I'm going to talk with her.<br />
# health: homesickness<br />
#* What's happening to you?<br />
#* I miss my family.<br />
#* Call them!<br />
#* Good idea.</div>Kmirhttps://mw.lojban.org/index.php?title=zbalermorna&diff=110628zbalermorna2014-12-22T12:36:38Z<p>Kmir: That TTF is waaay out of date and will cause confusion if propagated.</p>
<hr />
<div>[[File:display5.png]]<br />
<br />
{{quotation|After nearly two years, I have finally gotten around to posting the final version of this system: Zbalermorna.|[[la kmir]]}}<br />
<br />
You can read to <br />
<br />
*The full documentation: [[:File:ZLM4_Writeup_v2.pdf|Zbalermorna description]] or [https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B0aL1oAS_j4yZjZKa3ZYYUNUdnVZdHdEMW5pMGdJUQ in a public google doc]<br />
*[[:File:847.sip|a picture]]<br />
*[[:File:635.sip|a java converter]]<br />
=Discussion=<br />
*http://jbotcan.org/ideas/res/284.html</div>Kmir